Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Perhaps vanilla could port the pd-l2ork's <arrayname>_changed send that is attached to each array and is used in conjunction with the global presetting mechamism (preset_hub and preser_node objects). IIRC, canvas hosting the array should also trigger the "clicked" event.
Best,
Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Director, Creativity + Innovation Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
Virginia Tech Creative Technologies in Music School of Performing Arts – 0141 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 ico@vt.edu
ci.icat.vt.edu l2ork.icat.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net ________________________________ From: Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com Sent: Friday, August 9, 2024 5:50:43 PM To: pd-list@lists.iem.at pd-list@lists.iem.at Subject: [PD] "Click" and "Change" Notifications for Array Elements in Data Structures
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
hmmm, a setable receive symbols for arrays could be interesting. I see the message it gets is just a 'bang' whenever there is a click, but being able to retrieve the index and value of the changed element in a receive symbol seems like a nice thing to have. Though I have lived without this just fine and I'm not really sure about the use cases.
I had kind of a use case for this, but I realized that what I wanted was a multislider GUI, so I made one that just works nicely as one. Using arrays as a hack for multislider is a problem for me because I didn't want just the 'jump on click' behaviour.
So I'm not sure about just requesting this functionality on its own, now that I have my 'true' multislider. I'd go for it if we could also expand arrays and also add a 'steady on click' mode, and also a 'bar visualization mode'... but then maybe that's adding too many things just so arrays work like something else.
Nonetheless, maybe just adding this functionality on its own could indeed be a good thing.
One way to always 'poll' the values, of course, is with [tabread~], and it works at signal rate
cheers
Em sáb., 10 de ago. de 2024 às 03:20, Bukvic, Ivica ico@vt.edu escreveu:
Perhaps vanilla could port the pd-l2ork's <arrayname>_changed send that is attached to each array and is used in conjunction with the global presetting mechamism (preset_hub and preser_node objects). IIRC, canvas hosting the array should also trigger the "clicked" event.
Best,
Ico
Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Director, Creativity + Innovation Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
Virginia Tech Creative Technologies in Music School of Performing Arts – 0141 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 ico@vt.edu
ci.icat.vt.edu l2ork.icat.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net
*From:* Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com *Sent:* Friday, August 9, 2024 5:50:43 PM *To:* pd-list@lists.iem.at pd-list@lists.iem.at *Subject:* [PD] "Click" and "Change" Notifications for Array Elements in Data Structures
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/JOZZ4J7IUR...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
I might be mistaken, but I understand that data structures were originally designed to facilitate the creation of graphical scores. The way the mouse interacts with array elements seems like a great foundation for incorporating symbols within a "frame". For example, a user could create a staff with clickable and draggable notes, using Pure Data's native tools (and a library containing the coordinates to create the symbols)...
Il giorno dom 11 ago 2024 alle ore 03:21 Alexandre Torres Porres < porres@gmail.com> ha scritto:
hmmm, a setable receive symbols for arrays could be interesting. I see the message it gets is just a 'bang' whenever there is a click, but being able to retrieve the index and value of the changed element in a receive symbol seems like a nice thing to have. Though I have lived without this just fine and I'm not really sure about the use cases.
I had kind of a use case for this, but I realized that what I wanted was a multislider GUI, so I made one that just works nicely as one. Using arrays as a hack for multislider is a problem for me because I didn't want just the 'jump on click' behaviour.
So I'm not sure about just requesting this functionality on its own, now that I have my 'true' multislider. I'd go for it if we could also expand arrays and also add a 'steady on click' mode, and also a 'bar visualization mode'... but then maybe that's adding too many things just so arrays work like something else.
Nonetheless, maybe just adding this functionality on its own could indeed be a good thing.
One way to always 'poll' the values, of course, is with [tabread~], and it works at signal rate
cheers
Em sáb., 10 de ago. de 2024 às 03:20, Bukvic, Ivica ico@vt.edu escreveu:
Perhaps vanilla could port the pd-l2ork's <arrayname>_changed send that is attached to each array and is used in conjunction with the global presetting mechamism (preset_hub and preser_node objects). IIRC, canvas hosting the array should also trigger the "clicked" event.
Best,
Ico
Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Director, Creativity + Innovation Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
Virginia Tech Creative Technologies in Music School of Performing Arts – 0141 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 ico@vt.edu
ci.icat.vt.edu l2ork.icat.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net
*From:* Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com *Sent:* Friday, August 9, 2024 5:50:43 PM *To:* pd-list@lists.iem.at pd-list@lists.iem.at *Subject:* [PD] "Click" and "Change" Notifications for Array Elements in Data Structures
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/JOZZ4J7IUR...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/ZB2ADMFEPD...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
opened a request https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/issues/2395
Em qua., 14 de ago. de 2024 às 09:58, Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com escreveu:
I might be mistaken, but I understand that data structures were originally designed to facilitate the creation of graphical scores. The way the mouse interacts with array elements seems like a great foundation for incorporating symbols within a "frame". For example, a user could create a staff with clickable and draggable notes, using Pure Data's native tools (and a library containing the coordinates to create the symbols)...
Il giorno dom 11 ago 2024 alle ore 03:21 Alexandre Torres Porres < porres@gmail.com> ha scritto:
hmmm, a setable receive symbols for arrays could be interesting. I see the message it gets is just a 'bang' whenever there is a click, but being able to retrieve the index and value of the changed element in a receive symbol seems like a nice thing to have. Though I have lived without this just fine and I'm not really sure about the use cases.
I had kind of a use case for this, but I realized that what I wanted was a multislider GUI, so I made one that just works nicely as one. Using arrays as a hack for multislider is a problem for me because I didn't want just the 'jump on click' behaviour.
So I'm not sure about just requesting this functionality on its own, now that I have my 'true' multislider. I'd go for it if we could also expand arrays and also add a 'steady on click' mode, and also a 'bar visualization mode'... but then maybe that's adding too many things just so arrays work like something else.
Nonetheless, maybe just adding this functionality on its own could indeed be a good thing.
One way to always 'poll' the values, of course, is with [tabread~], and it works at signal rate
cheers
Em sáb., 10 de ago. de 2024 às 03:20, Bukvic, Ivica ico@vt.edu escreveu:
Perhaps vanilla could port the pd-l2ork's <arrayname>_changed send that is attached to each array and is used in conjunction with the global presetting mechamism (preset_hub and preser_node objects). IIRC, canvas hosting the array should also trigger the "clicked" event.
Best,
Ico
Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Director, Creativity + Innovation Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
Virginia Tech Creative Technologies in Music School of Performing Arts – 0141 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 ico@vt.edu
ci.icat.vt.edu l2ork.icat.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net
*From:* Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com *Sent:* Friday, August 9, 2024 5:50:43 PM *To:* pd-list@lists.iem.at pd-list@lists.iem.at *Subject:* [PD] "Click" and "Change" Notifications for Array Elements in Data Structures
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/JOZZ4J7IUR...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/ZB2ADMFEPD...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
Thank you for opening the request, I'm glad to see that this issue interests others as well.
Pierpaolo
Il giorno mer 14 ago 2024 alle ore 17:49 Alexandre Torres Porres < porres@gmail.com> ha scritto:
opened a request https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/issues/2395
Em qua., 14 de ago. de 2024 às 09:58, Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com escreveu:
I might be mistaken, but I understand that data structures were originally designed to facilitate the creation of graphical scores. The way the mouse interacts with array elements seems like a great foundation for incorporating symbols within a "frame". For example, a user could create a staff with clickable and draggable notes, using Pure Data's native tools (and a library containing the coordinates to create the symbols)...
Il giorno dom 11 ago 2024 alle ore 03:21 Alexandre Torres Porres < porres@gmail.com> ha scritto:
hmmm, a setable receive symbols for arrays could be interesting. I see the message it gets is just a 'bang' whenever there is a click, but being able to retrieve the index and value of the changed element in a receive symbol seems like a nice thing to have. Though I have lived without this just fine and I'm not really sure about the use cases.
I had kind of a use case for this, but I realized that what I wanted was a multislider GUI, so I made one that just works nicely as one. Using arrays as a hack for multislider is a problem for me because I didn't want just the 'jump on click' behaviour.
So I'm not sure about just requesting this functionality on its own, now that I have my 'true' multislider. I'd go for it if we could also expand arrays and also add a 'steady on click' mode, and also a 'bar visualization mode'... but then maybe that's adding too many things just so arrays work like something else.
Nonetheless, maybe just adding this functionality on its own could indeed be a good thing.
One way to always 'poll' the values, of course, is with [tabread~], and it works at signal rate
cheers
Em sáb., 10 de ago. de 2024 às 03:20, Bukvic, Ivica ico@vt.edu escreveu:
Perhaps vanilla could port the pd-l2ork's <arrayname>_changed send that is attached to each array and is used in conjunction with the global presetting mechamism (preset_hub and preser_node objects). IIRC, canvas hosting the array should also trigger the "clicked" event.
Best,
Ico
Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Director, Creativity + Innovation Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
Virginia Tech Creative Technologies in Music School of Performing Arts – 0141 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 ico@vt.edu
ci.icat.vt.edu l2ork.icat.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net
*From:* Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com *Sent:* Friday, August 9, 2024 5:50:43 PM *To:* pd-list@lists.iem.at pd-list@lists.iem.at *Subject:* [PD] "Click" and "Change" Notifications for Array Elements in Data Structures
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/JOZZ4J7IUR...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/ZB2ADMFEPD...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
arrays do send click messages when clicked - unless you're dragging the mouse for a long time, a partial solution could be to use the message to trigger a time-limited polling (and when this polling finds differences, activates itself again).
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Thank you for the advice, I didn't know that Purr-Data had this capability for arrays! However, it seems that even there, structures behave similarly regarding this issue. It's true that "clicked" messages are sent, but they trigger when clicking on an undefined area of the canvas that represents the entire structure, even in the case of multiple arrays. Additionally, these messages return the coordinates of each element but not when clicking on the elements themselves...
The goal would be to make the substructure that identifies each element able to detect multiple coordinates. I wonder how challenging this would be.
Il giorno sab 10 ago 2024 alle ore 11:36 João Pais jmmmpais@gmail.com ha scritto:
arrays do send click messages when clicked - unless you're dragging the mouse for a long time, a partial solution could be to use the message to trigger a time-limited polling (and when this polling finds differences, activates itself again).
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/RK37WCFHSP...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
It seems that if you [print] from the element's struct you get 'click messages' with pointers for every element in the array when clicking, is that it?
I guess this same [struct] should then just also send a 'change' message for the pointer of the element that is being changed. It does make sense and seems like a natural thing given how stuff works in general. I'd like to see that!
I haven't looked at the code, but I guess you could just open this request on github.
cheers
Em sáb., 10 de ago. de 2024 às 12:06, Pier Bar pier.ba001@gmail.com escreveu:
Thank you for the advice, I didn't know that Purr-Data had this capability for arrays! However, it seems that even there, structures behave similarly regarding this issue. It's true that "clicked" messages are sent, but they trigger when clicking on an undefined area of the canvas that represents the entire structure, even in the case of multiple arrays. Additionally, these messages return the coordinates of each element but not when clicking on the elements themselves...
The goal would be to make the substructure that identifies each element able to detect multiple coordinates. I wonder how challenging this would be.
Il giorno sab 10 ago 2024 alle ore 11:36 João Pais jmmmpais@gmail.com ha scritto:
arrays do send click messages when clicked - unless you're dragging the mouse for a long time, a partial solution could be to use the message to trigger a time-limited polling (and when this polling finds differences, activates itself again).
Hello,
I've noticed that while structures in Pure Data usually can send "click" and "change" notifications when modified, this behavior doesn't seem to apply to the elements of an array within these structures (apart from polling solutions like using [metro]).
How difficult would it be to change this behavior in the future, or would Pure Data's architecture not easily allow for it?
Best regards,
Pierpaolo Barbiero
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/RK37WCFHSP...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/
Pd-list - pd-list@lists.iem.at
https://lists.iem.at/hyperkitty/list/pd-list@lists.iem.at/message/2P634W3NDL...
To unsubscribe send an email to pd-list-leave@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.iem.at/