Pd-list July 2017

pd-list@lists.iem.at

61 participants
131 discussions

New users and external path struggles
by jmejia＠anestheticaudio.com 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

Going through Alex's excellent documentation made me think about how nearly every single new PD user I encounter struggles with OS specific problems when it comes installing externals. As a teacher who introduces a lot of new people to PD - I see this a LOT. The standard place for putting externals on OSX (~/Library) is hidden by default - and various versions of OSX require various ways of un-hiding. Similarly the windows path is hard to find - and permissions and view settings need to change to make that folder as well. So even once the users understand they need to *make* a folder - their OS stops them from making it in the right place. It would be great if that os specific stuff was included - because it's a major stumbling block for a lot of new users. This can be sort of mediated with by a bunch of clear and easy to find OS specific instructions - but that's hard when OSX keeps changing things etc. I'm happy to write these if that's the best course of action. Basically it means you need to get deep with your OS, and probably do some google searches to figure out how create a folder in protected system space before deken is actually useful. Most similar software uses unprotected user space as a default place for installing external libraries. /Documents/Max7, /Documents/Processing/Libraries - etc. Could we add a location like this to PD's standard search path? Then users could create the folder without jumping through a lot of hoops with their OS. I understand that users can add a path like this manually - but that's an additional hurdle - and since deken is so tightly integrated, it doesn't seem like that should be necessary. It also causes confusion when you move paths across systems.

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Re: [PD] New users and external path struggles
by Dan Wilcox 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

As I've mentioned on the super long Github discussion about this, I am working on a proposal to fix all of this. Maybe y'all should wait a bit and see if it solves things? > On Jul 30, 2017, at 5:39 PM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > Of course there can be always improvements made to deken but I think we got to a point where it's already really easy and convenient to use. I think we just have to communicate things and Alex' HOWTO is a great starting point. 14 pages (with a huge font size) is not a lot and it contains essential information every Pd user has to know. -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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Re: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd 0.48-0test6 released
by Dan Wilcox 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

It's saved to the GUI preferences, not the core preferences, so it will not appear in settings exports. There is a distinction between the core settings and GUI-specific stuff like the recent files list, log level, and now the deken install path. If you want to change that, maybe open another 100+ post discussion or, better yet, write some code as a proposal. I chose the latter. :) > On Jul 29, 2017, at 11:43 PM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > From: "Christof Ressi" <christof.ressi(a)gmx.at <mailto:christof.ressi@gmx.at>> > Subject: Re: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd 0.48-0test6 released > Date: July 29, 2017 at 10:54:41 PM GMT+2 > To: Pd-List <pd-list(a)lists.iem.at <mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at>> > > > yeah, it doesn't show up in the .pdsettings file. > > apart from that: everything looks fine on my Windows machine. thank you!! -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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Re: [PD] Question regarding the font of Pd-0.48
by Dan Wilcox 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

Font metrics will not. It's not as easy as "change the numbers in pd-gui.tcl" and involves finding & porting in all the sizing tweaks from extended (ie. object margins are different, widths of atoms is different, font placement is tweaked, etc). This is in the C core. I spent a whole day trying it last weekend and am still missing some stuff. I'm burned out on that and there are easier fish to fry, so I don't imagine doing that again after this weekend, any time soon. Your best solution for now is to drag the lower right hand corner of your patch window larger and add more space between things. There is really no "pixel perfect" guarantee for things, even if the extended font metrics and sizing are added. I think, technically, it can only ever be "close." For those that disagree, you're going to have to put some time into things as I have already... > On Jul 30, 2017, at 6:23 AM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > From: Zack Lee <cuinjune(a)gmail.com <mailto:cuinjune@gmail.com>> > Subject: Re: [PD] Question regarding the font of Pd-0.48 > Date: July 30, 2017 at 4:50:31 AM GMT+2 > To: Alexandre Torres Porres <porres(a)gmail.com <mailto:porres@gmail.com>> > Cc: Pd-List <pd-list(a)lists.iem.at <mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at>> > > > Hi Alexandre. > Thank you so much for your explanation. > I think it is a good idea to adopt Pd Extended's font metrics since I believe most of existing externals' help files are designed based on it. > I really hope this can be fixed before the stable release of Pd-0.48. > > Zack -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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Re: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas?
by Dan Wilcox 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

Can still crash on mac, if not the patch window doesn't open. This may not be a cross-platform solution due to the differences in window managers. > On Jul 29, 2017, at 11:30 AM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > From: Ingo Stock <mail(a)ingostock.de <mailto:mail@ingostock.de>> > Subject: Re: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas? > Date: July 29, 2017 at 3:11:30 AM GMT+2 > To: Pd-List <pd-list(a)lists.iem.at <mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at>> > > > On 29/07/17 02:45, Dan Wilcox wrote: >> Ouch. That crashes Pd for me on mac. > > Sorry about that. It works on linux. > > Here it is again without the loadbang. -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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Question regarding the font of Pd-0.48
by Zack Lee 30 Jul '17

30 Jul '17

Hi, I tried Pd-0.48-0test5 today and it looks like the font became wider than the one in 0.47-1. I personally like the change in font but some of my patches I created with 0.47-1 looks a bit dirty and jammed as objects are now wider in 0.48. For example, if you have a cyclone library, you can see [flush]'s help file. You will see some objects are partially overlapped. One can of course fix these patches and make them look nicer again provided that the font won't be changed again soon in the next update. I wonder if the current change in the font is completely fixed until the 0.48 stable release or is there any possibility that it will be changed again? Thanks! Zack

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Standard Paths & Canonical practice for managing/installing externals
by Alexandre Torres Porres 29 Jul '17

29 Jul '17

So, I got a tutorial on installing externals that says *standard paths** is where to put them - check it here <https://sites.google.com/site/porres/Using%20Pd%20Externals.pdf> on page 6 (got it from Pd's FAQ <https://puredata.info/docs/faq/how-do-i-install-externals-and-help-files>, btw). My view is reinforced by [declare]'s object design, which loads externals/libs from there with the *-stdpath* & *-stdlib* flags. Who agrees/disagrees? and if *standard paths** are not good for externals, what they good for? My concern is to understand *current* Pd's state in order to revise my tutorial regarding canonical practices for managing/installing externals. *Let's please keep this focus and not break the discussion, such as what would be desirable to happen for Pd in the future, we could have separate threads for that.* Thanks * *Standard paths* defined as 3 standard search paths for Pd: *A) *Application Specific; *B)* User specific; *C)* Global (where "A" is the "extra" folder, "B" & "C" are defined for each OS). "A" is only seen by the Pd application it's in. "B" is seen by all Pds for a user in a machine. And "C" is seen by All Pds / all users in a machine.

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Re: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas?
by Dan Wilcox 29 Jul '17

29 Jul '17

Looking in g_canvas.c, canvas can take a "click" message followed by 5 floats. The arguments are "t_floatarg xpos, t_floatarg ypos, t_floatarg shift, t_floatarg ctrl, t_floatarg alt" but it none of those are used, at least by the following function: static void canvas_click(t_canvas *x, t_floatarg xpos, t_floatarg ypos, t_floatarg shift, t_floatarg ctrl, t_floatarg alt) { canvas_vis(x, 1); } It seems to only make the canvas visible, so try sending "click 0 0 0 0 0" to a named canvas... > On Jul 28, 2017, at 6:32 PM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > From: Roman Haefeli <reduzent(a)gmail.com <mailto:reduzent@gmail.com>> > Subject: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas? > Date: July 28, 2017 at 4:55:26 PM GMT+2 > To: Pd-List <pd-list(a)lists.iem.at <mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at>> > > > Hey all > > Is it still possible in Pd to send a message to canvas in order to > emulate a mouse click? Some documents[1] and patches[2] on the Pure > Data wiki suggest it was possible with earlier versions of Pd, but I > can't get the examples to work with current Pd. > > My aim is to make a symbolatom ready for text input without clicking it > first. > > Roman -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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Re: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas?
by Dan Wilcox 29 Jul '17

29 Jul '17

Ouch. That crashes Pd for me on mac. > On Jul 29, 2017, at 2:27 AM, pd-list-request(a)lists.iem.at wrote: > > From: Ingo Stock <mail(a)ingostock.de <mailto:mail@ingostock.de>> > Subject: Re: [PD] how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas? > Date: July 29, 2017 at 2:27:39 AM GMT+2 > To: pd-list(a)lists.iem.at <mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at> > > > Here is a working example patch. > > best wishes, ingo -------- Dan Wilcox @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika> danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/> robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>

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how to emulate mouse left-click to canvas?
by Roman Haefeli 29 Jul '17

29 Jul '17

Hey all Is it still possible in Pd to send a message to canvas in order to emulate a mouse click? Some documents[1] and patches[2] on the Pure Data wiki suggest it was possible with earlier versions of Pd, but I can't get the examples to work with current Pd. My aim is to make a symbolatom ready for text input without clicking it first. Roman [1] https://puredata.info/community/pdwiki/PdInternalMessages [2] http://dh7.free.fr/pd-msg/pd-msg_05.tar.gz

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Pd-list July 2017