Hi list,
This is a topic which has been discussed a few times here already, but since things seem to be moving pretty fast, I'm opening it again.
I would like to have a very small computer running Pd that could be carried around more easily than current laptops. It also had to be powerful enough to run Pd in rt.
I've been following the Raspberry Pi project for a few months, but their CPU is only running at 800 MHz, and i think it'd be difficult to get reasonable rt performances.
There's also the Dream Plug ( http://www.plugcomputer.org/development-kits/dreamplug.html), which has a faster (though totally unknown to me) CPU.
I have no idea if it would be hard to install Pd on these machines. Do you have any idea or suggestion? Also, do you know if there exist small (and cheap) displays that could be used with these computers? It makes no sense to me to buy a computer the size of a Arduino board if i need to carry a desktop display with it...
Cheers!
Pierre
hi pierre and all - i'm also quite interested in this and have been following developments in the R-Pi for this very reason . in fact i recently started investigating whether or not i could run my live Max/MSP processing setup (recoding in PD) on something like the Pi. the 700MHz Broadcom chip onboard is as fast as an iPhone 3GS, and the 3GS was actually underclocked. depending on what you'd want to do it might be able to handle it-there is also the tantalizing possibility that the Broadcom video chip could be used to perform DSP (it wouldn't be anytime soon, unfortunately).
i'd say a certain amount of realtime processing, especially audio, is fine, unless you're using 32 granulators running full tilt with spatialized sound. live video might also be a tall order, but i suppose they could be networked together. i myself plan to use an external USB interface from Tascam that has Linux support although it's a bit fiddly to set up. it's a bit of an experiment to see if it would run, but for $35 it's pretty cheap to try it out.
on the higher end there is the Beagle Board using an OMAP3530 for $149 (the Xm version) or the Beagle Bone development board for $89 (which isn't really a small computer as it has no video out). Barring that you'd be going upwards in cost past $200 for a MIni ITX board based on a VIA or dual core Atom chip, getting you a MacMini sized computer.
as far as displays these are relatively cheap and plentiful. 7 and 9 inch screens can be found all over Amazon and eBay, although a few of these use USB to output video. i want a screen/control interface so the plan is to use a tablet with onscreen controls sending out OSC messages to PD via a wifi dongle, or maybe directly over USB. something like TouchOSC or Charlie Robert's Control app was my first choice.
i'm curious what your exact requirements are. i was investigating how much power an ARM 1176 could run in PD. there's some discussion of it on the PD Everywhere group board on Noisepages where they were talking about libpd running on a iPhone 3G and how much it could do (remember these were underclocked, so technically the RPi would be faster).
scott
On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 5:24 PM, Pierre Massat pimassat@gmail.com wrote:
Hi list,
This is a topic which has been discussed a few times here already, but since things seem to be moving pretty fast, I'm opening it again.
I would like to have a very small computer running Pd that could be carried around more easily than current laptops. It also had to be powerful enough to run Pd in rt.
I've been following the Raspberry Pi project for a few months, but their CPU is only running at 800 MHz, and i think it'd be difficult to get reasonable rt performances.
There's also the Dream Plug (http://www.plugcomputer.org/development-kits/dreamplug.html), which has a faster (though totally unknown to me) CPU.
I have no idea if it would be hard to install Pd on these machines. Do you have any idea or suggestion? Also, do you know if there exist small (and cheap) displays that could be used with these computers? It makes no sense to me to buy a computer the size of a Arduino board if i need to carry a desktop display with it...
Cheers!
Pierre
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 2:24 AM, Pierre Massat pimassat@gmail.com wrote:
There's also the Dream Plug (http://www.plugcomputer.org/development-kits/dreamplug.html), which has a faster (though totally unknown to me) CPU.
According to the processor documentation it is ARMv5TE-compliant, and there's also a Dream Plug with ARMv5 mentioned on:
http://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/TargetedHardware
It is not the newest generation of ARM, so it would not be comparable to a recent tablet.
This page discusses performance comparisons of ARM versus x86:
http://vanshardware.com/2010/08/mirror-the-coming-war-arm-versus-x86/
ARM seems to perform slow with floating point, and Pd is all floating point. An Atom based computer might be better for Pd. I have no experience with ARM, but of Atom-based netbooks I know (also from experience) that Pd performs reasonably well under Debian. Roughly three times slower than a laptop, I would say.
Katja
Thank you both for your replies. It seems like i'll stick to my laptop for some time...
Cheers!
Pierre
2012/1/8 katja katjavetter@gmail.com
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 2:24 AM, Pierre Massat pimassat@gmail.com wrote:
There's also the Dream Plug (http://www.plugcomputer.org/development-kits/dreamplug.html), which
has a
faster (though totally unknown to me) CPU.
According to the processor documentation it is ARMv5TE-compliant, and there's also a Dream Plug with ARMv5 mentioned on:
http://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/TargetedHardware
It is not the newest generation of ARM, so it would not be comparable to a recent tablet.
This page discusses performance comparisons of ARM versus x86:
http://vanshardware.com/2010/08/mirror-the-coming-war-arm-versus-x86/
ARM seems to perform slow with floating point, and Pd is all floating point. An Atom based computer might be better for Pd. I have no experience with ARM, but of Atom-based netbooks I know (also from experience) that Pd performs reasonably well under Debian. Roughly three times slower than a laptop, I would say.
Katja
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
On Jan 8, 2012, at 9:14 AM, katja wrote:
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 2:24 AM, Pierre Massat pimassat@gmail.com wrote:
There's also the Dream Plug (http://www.plugcomputer.org/development-kits/dreamplug.html), which has a faster (though totally unknown to me) CPU.
According to the processor documentation it is ARMv5TE-compliant, and there's also a Dream Plug with ARMv5 mentioned on:
http://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/TargetedHardware
It is not the newest generation of ARM, so it would not be comparable to a recent tablet.
This page discusses performance comparisons of ARM versus x86:
http://vanshardware.com/2010/08/mirror-the-coming-war-arm-versus-x86/
ARM seems to perform slow with floating point, and Pd is all floating point. An Atom based computer might be better for Pd. I have no experience with ARM, but of Atom-based netbooks I know (also from experience) that Pd performs reasonably well under Debian. Roughly three times slower than a laptop, I would say.
All of the big smartphones and tablets use ARM chips that have floating point units that are decent. There is also the pd-anywhere integer-only port of Pd. It is usable on 200Mhz integer-only ARMs.
.hc
Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams