Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I have no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
Ingo
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I have no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes
If you're running OSX with pdp X11 may need to fire up but that is not GEM
pp
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at] On Behalf Of IOhannes m zmölnig Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM To: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: 'pd-list' Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I have no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Yes, if you use a pdp2gem or pdp library... but if you only use GEM dont need X (I think that)....
Best regards from chile.... and current error... when i open pdp the x screeen open but not show the video... i need restart pd with the x open and works fine.
Best regards from Chile
José
2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu
If you're running OSX with pdp X11 may need to fire up but that is not GEM
pp
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at] On Behalf Of IOhannes m zmölnig Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM To: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: 'pd-list' Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I
have
no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iEYEARECAAYFAkvr6J0ACgkQkX2Xpv6ydvTHZwCePA5YFXcV2I5vZRkRI4OceG++ JHYAnicG/nhjM+BN1bPD8/VWSmuccuKo =fs+z -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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You can also send a message to the pdp_xv or pdp_glx to I think [autostart 1] it says it in the pd window So you do not have to restart
From: Jose Luis Santorcuato [mailto:santorcuato76@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 11:06 AM To: Pagano, Patrick Cc: IOhannes m zmölnig; Ingo Scherzinger; pd-list Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
Yes, if you use a pdp2gem or pdp library... but if you only use GEM dont need X (I think that)....
Best regards from chile.... and current error... when i open pdp the x screeen open but not show the video... i need restart pd with the x open and works fine.
Best regards from Chile
José
2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick <pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edumailto:pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu> If you're running OSX with pdp X11 may need to fire up but that is not GEM
pp
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces@iem.atmailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.atmailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at] On Behalf Of IOhannes m zmölnig Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM To: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: 'pd-list' Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I have no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes
Pd-list@iem.atmailto:Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Pd-list@iem.atmailto:Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
-- http://www.chilemigra.cl http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com http://www.myspace.com/santorcuato
Yes? maybe, but my blackbook is a like a shit.... intel gma.... too much problems with graphics...but work, i dont use pdp_glx , i prefer work with gem as final screen, pdp_glx with intel cards work poor.
Best regards
José
2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu
You can also send a message to the pdp_xv or pdp_glx to I think [autostart 1] it says it in the pd window
So you do not have to restart
*From:* Jose Luis Santorcuato [mailto:santorcuato76@gmail.com] *Sent:* Thursday, May 13, 2010 11:06 AM *To:* Pagano, Patrick *Cc:* IOhannes m zmölnig; Ingo Scherzinger; pd-list
*Subject:* Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
Yes, if you use a pdp2gem or pdp library... but if you only use GEM dont need X (I think that)....
Best regards from chile.... and current error... when i open pdp the x screeen open but not show the video... i need restart pd with the x open and works fine.
Best regards from Chile
José
2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu
If you're running OSX with pdp X11 may need to fire up but that is not GEM
pp
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at] On Behalf Of IOhannes m zmölnig Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM To: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: 'pd-list' Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I
have
no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iEYEARECAAYFAkvr6J0ACgkQkX2Xpv6ydvTHZwCePA5YFXcV2I5vZRkRI4OceG++ JHYAnicG/nhjM+BN1bPD8/VWSmuccuKo =fs+z -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
-- http://www.chilemigra.cl http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com http://www.myspace.com/santorcuato
Try pdp_xv or if it's build pdp_sdl
pp
From: Jose Luis Santorcuato [mailto:santorcuato76@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 11:12 AM To: Pagano, Patrick Cc: IOhannes m zmölnig; Ingo Scherzinger; pd-list Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
Yes? maybe, but my blackbook is a like a shit.... intel gma.... too much problems with graphics...but work, i dont use pdp_glx , i prefer work with gem as final screen, pdp_glx with intel cards work poor.
Best regards
José 2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick <pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edumailto:pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu> You can also send a message to the pdp_xv or pdp_glx to I think [autostart 1] it says it in the pd window So you do not have to restart
From: Jose Luis Santorcuato [mailto:santorcuato76@gmail.commailto:santorcuato76@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 11:06 AM To: Pagano, Patrick Cc: IOhannes m zmölnig; Ingo Scherzinger; pd-list
Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
Yes, if you use a pdp2gem or pdp library... but if you only use GEM dont need X (I think that)....
Best regards from chile.... and current error... when i open pdp the x screeen open but not show the video... i need restart pd with the x open and works fine.
Best regards from Chile
José
2010/5/13 Pagano, Patrick <pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edumailto:pat@digitalworlds.ufl.edu> If you're running OSX with pdp X11 may need to fire up but that is not GEM
pp
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces@iem.atmailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.atmailto:pd-list-bounces@iem.at] On Behalf Of IOhannes m zmölnig Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM To: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: 'pd-list' Subject: Re: [PD] Does GEM need X-Server to be running
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, this may be a pretty stupid question but since I'm new to GEM I have no idea.
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
fgmasdr IOhannes
Pd-list@iem.atmailto:Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Pd-list@iem.atmailto:Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
-- http://www.chilemigra.cl http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com http://www.myspace.com/santorcuato
-- http://www.chilemigra.cl http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com http://www.myspace.com/santorcuato
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm on Linux (Ubuntu 10.04). I need to display the GEM window with the machine I'm running it on. So that means I basically have to keep the system graphics turned on I guess.
Try pdp_xv or if its build pdp_sdl
Would this allow me to turn the system graphics off and only display the GEM window?
Ingo
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to the graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm on Linux (Ubuntu 10.04). I need to display the GEM window with the machine I'm running it on. So that means I basically have to keep the system graphics turned on I guess.
yes. butt after all, you want graphics, don't you? so why would you want to turn them off? get rid of your desktop environment and your window manager if you want to keep ressources low.
(maybe this is a misunderstanding? you don't want all the fancy wm and de stuff, when you talk about "system graphics" and "Xserver"? Gem doesn't need anything fancy, but it does need an Xserver.
the Xserver really only provides an abstracted interface to the gfx card (and to devices like mouse/keyboard), so your application doesn't need to know that it is talking to an "Intel Corporation Mobile 945GME Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03)" or whatever card you have installed on your system. this is quite nice, as you don't need special binaries of Gem depending on your gfx card)
Try pdp_xv or if it’s build pdp_sdl
Would this allow me to turn the system graphics off and only display the GEM window?
pdp_xv creates an XVisual; the X already hints that you need an X-server.
the pdp_sdl should be able to work without X (depending on the SDL backends you have installed on your system; e.g. you might be able to output in AsciiArt) however, if you want to work with Gem (e.g. by using the gem2pdp bridge to display via pdp) you will still need to allow Gem to create a window, for which you need an Xserver.
mfgasdr IOhannes
Hi IOhannes,
maybe it would be good to know what you want to achieve (or workaround) in the first place.
I only need to keep the resources as low as possible since I'm also running a very heavy audio pd patch in parallel with GEM in a hardware like environement. So I guess turning off all graphic processes using cpu will be the best solution. Since the other (audio) patch is running with the -nosleep flag I suppose the graphics cpu load will go to the other cpu anyway in the first place. While keeping GEM at fullscreen I guess the regular system can't be messed around with because there is no access to the regular desktop. That's completely ok with me. I simply wanted to figure out how to save the maximum amount of resources and if it was possible to eliminate X-Server completely.
Thank you for the information! Ingo
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Does GEM need X-Server to be running or does it connect directly to
the
graphic card?
whether you need an X-server, depends on your platform. on windows, Gem uses platform dependend code to create windows and to establish an openGL context. on X-platforms (linux, bsd, irix,...) it will use X/glx, so you will need an X-server somewhere to display (not necessarily the machine you are running Pd on). on OSX it will use Carbon/AGL. on w32 it will use windows/wgl.
i don't know of any program that "directly connects to the graphics card" and still wants to do more than copying pixels into some legacy buffer.
Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm on Linux (Ubuntu 10.04). I need to display the GEM window with the machine I'm running it on. So that means I basically have to keep the system graphics turned on I guess.
yes. butt after all, you want graphics, don't you? so why would you want to turn them off? get rid of your desktop environment and your window manager if you want to keep ressources low.
(maybe this is a misunderstanding? you don't want all the fancy wm and de stuff, when you talk about "system graphics" and "Xserver"? Gem doesn't need anything fancy, but it does need an Xserver.
the Xserver really only provides an abstracted interface to the gfx card (and to devices like mouse/keyboard), so your application doesn't need to know that it is talking to an "Intel Corporation Mobile 945GME Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03)" or whatever card you have installed on your system. this is quite nice, as you don't need special binaries of Gem depending on your gfx card)
Try pdp_xv or if its build pdp_sdl
Would this allow me to turn the system graphics off and only display the
GEM
window?
pdp_xv creates an XVisual; the X already hints that you need an X-server.
the pdp_sdl should be able to work without X (depending on the SDL backends you have installed on your system; e.g. you might be able to output in AsciiArt) however, if you want to work with Gem (e.g. by using the gem2pdp bridge to display via pdp) you will still need to allow Gem to create a window, for which you need an Xserver.
mfgasdr IOhannes -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Hi IOhannes,
maybe it would be good to know what you want to achieve (or workaround) in the first place.
I only need to keep the resources as low as possible since I'm also running a very heavy audio pd patch in parallel with GEM in a hardware like environement. So I guess turning off all graphic processes using cpu will be the best solution.
well, the Xserver provides the infrastructure to access the gfx card. it doesn't do any graphic processing on it's own.
you could see the Xserver as the "kernel" of the gfx-subsystem (e.g. it handles the drivers for the gfx-cards) even though your audio patch needs all the ressources, you probably still want the kernel running...
While keeping GEM at fullscreen I guess the regular system can't be messed around with because there is no access to the regular desktop.
again: X does not provide a desktop. (switch to console and become root; stop your desktop environment (something like "/etc/init.d/gdm stop" if you are running gnome; use kdm if you are running kde); start the X-server by simply running "X": that's the Xserver; you _can_ run Gem in this environment)
so there is nothing to mess around with.
That's completely ok with me. I simply wanted to figure out how to save the maximum amount of resources and if it was possible to eliminate X-Server completely.
the Xserver will help you safe resources.
msar IOhannes
Thanx again, IOhannes!
I'll follow your suggestions about running X without desktop.
Ingo
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Hi IOhannes,
maybe it would be good to know what you want to achieve (or workaround) in the first place.
I only need to keep the resources as low as possible since I'm also
running
a very heavy audio pd patch in parallel with GEM in a hardware like environement. So I guess turning off all graphic processes using cpu
will be
the best solution.
well, the Xserver provides the infrastructure to access the gfx card. it doesn't do any graphic processing on it's own.
you could see the Xserver as the "kernel" of the gfx-subsystem (e.g. it handles the drivers for the gfx-cards) even though your audio patch needs all the ressources, you probably still want the kernel running...
While keeping GEM at fullscreen I guess the regular system can't be
messed
around with because there is no access to the regular desktop.
again: X does not provide a desktop. (switch to console and become root; stop your desktop environment (something like "/etc/init.d/gdm stop" if you are running gnome; use kdm if you are running kde); start the X-server by simply running "X": that's the Xserver; you _can_ run Gem in this environment)
so there is nothing to mess around with.
That's completely ok with me. I simply wanted to figure out how to save
the
maximum amount of resources and if it was possible to eliminate X-Server completely.
the Xserver will help you safe resources.
msar IOhannes -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iEYEARECAAYFAkvtIqEACgkQkX2Xpv6ydvSNfgCdGQ5NDUGB9D1veLVqbq8f9H eU 6TgAn26GxePaYxtR+ptEinns532jWgeN =IJEq -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Ingo Scherzinger wrote:
Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm on Linux (Ubuntu 10.04). I need to display the GEM window with the machine I'm running it on. So that means I basically have to keep the system graphics turned on I guess.
maybe it would be good to know what you want to achieve (or workaround) in the first place.
mfgasdr IOhannes
-
Ingo Scherzinger -
IOhannes m zmölnig -
Jose Luis Santorcuato -
Pagano, Patrick