At 17:49 13.07.2005, Miller Puckette wrote:

I think you just undefine MSW in s_entry.c (so that it makes a main() routine instead of a WinMain()).. Run with the -stderr flag and presto.

Is there enough need for this that I should supply a "pd-console" version in the standard release? I can't decide...

i personally would think that there's enough need, but as nobody beside you and antonias replied to this thread it seems not to be the case or everybody who needs fast prints just uses the devel version anyway.

sven.

On Jul 14, 2005, at 8:10 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:

Miller Puckette wrote:

...

I think you just undefine MSW in s_entry.c (so that it makes a main() routine instead of a WinMain()).. Run with the -stderr flag and
presto. Is there enough need for this that I should supply a "pd-console"
version in the standard release? I can't decide...

i support sven, as i think that having a console version is important
even on windows.

after some investigation (i think i've posted in to the tracker a
while ago) it seems that the most "standard" way to do this, is by
creating 2 applications, one pd.exe (being the windows version) and
one pd.com (console version); this hack is even used by M$ themselves.

for some weird historic reasons, the DOS-box still prefers .com over
.exe, so if you type "pd" (supposed that you have set the paths
right), you will automatically get the console-version, which i think
is ok, as you are running pd from the DOS-box anyhow.

all links to the application,... would go to the pd.exe, which has no
console support.

I think a flag is a muuuuch cleaner way to do this. What's wrong with
-stderr?

.hc

"Information wants to be free." -Stewart Brand

after re-reading the text, i have to add some noise and correct myself:

IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:

you cannot have an application that decides at runtime to which group it belongs. (although i am fully with you, that it would be far more elegant)

should read: although i am fully with you, that it would be far more elegant to just use a flag (-stderr) to change the behaviour)

my source of information has always been http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdnmag/issues/04/02/CQA/ i guess, they do know their OS.

so the article is not by M$ themselves, but taken from the MSDN-magazine (which i thought would be authorized by M$, but there is no evidence for this) furthermore, the journalist states, that this is just one way of possibly many to achieve this goal.

she mentions another one, that would work only on XP; please let us do some solution that will work on any w32-platform that pd currently runs on.

mfg.asd.r IOhannes

On Jul 15, 2005, at 2:41 PM, DrDOS wrote:

On Fri, Jul 15, 2005 at 07:54:34PM +0200, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:

...

Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:

...

I think a flag is a muuuuch cleaner way to do this. What's wrong
with -stderr?

nothing but the fact that this does not work on windows.

Right, I was a bit too quick to speak. But mostly I was concerned
about adding some platform-specific oddness. A hack to get -stderr
working on Windows would be ideal. One option might be to use the
System Event Log in windows, but it would probably be a pain to use.

...

either an application is a true windows application, then stderr will
go into nirvana; or the application is a "DOS"-application, then it will have this annoying DOS-box that confuses most people. you cannot have an application that decides at runtime to which group
it belongs.

i think it might be possible to have both, at least if you compile
with mingw, and add the -mwindows flag during linking (and the
-mms-bitfields is it, flag to gcc so that its binary compatible with
MSVC) . then it will not pop up a DOS window, but if you start from
cmd.exe, you will see the -stderr stuff..

Sounds great if it works. On that note, I've tried in the past to get
the MinGW compilation working and I didn't have much luck. I started
documenting the process here: http://puredata.org/docs/developer/mingw
it would be awesome if you could complete it. I'd like to be able to
compile Pd-extended builds and auto-building for Windows too and I
really don't want to have to learn MSVS.

...

(although i am fully with you, that it would be far more elegant)

how about contextual errors (balloon popups over the spot where the
error or print occured)..

That would be quite nice, but a little more difficult to code...

.hc

        "The arc of history bends towards justice."
                                        - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

I suspect they don't. I ended up finding the same thing out through painful trial and error, which seems to be the only way to code for MSW...

my source of information has always been http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdnmag/issues/04/02/CQA/ i guess, they do know their OS.

Hallo, Jacob Last hat gesagt: // Jacob Last wrote:

sending the message

[ ; array1 10 0.5 (

will set the 10th array position to 0.5. This is the best way to do it as far as I know.

Well, the usual way to do that is using [tabwrite]. ;-)

Ciao

Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__

      _ __latest track: "plak" @ http://footils.org/cms/show/44

I guess I didn't explaind correctly: I wanted to change the vertical borders, not only -1 to 1, but to set them when necessary. I use arrays to display envelopes, and it would be handy when I could change them accordingly.

yes, I saw example 15, and the more arrays as well, but I think this feature isn't (yet) covered in pd. arrays were thought to be exclusive for audio data only.

Am Wed, 13 Jul 2005 17:36:36 +0200 schrieb Urs Liska pd@ursliska.de:

You can use the normalize message to change all vertical values at the
same time.

But I'm not sure I understand your question. What do you exactly want to
change: A single value? - that's what Jacob Last answered. The vertical
"size" (i.e. possible range of values)? - that's not necessary I think.

Did you see the 15.array.pd patch in the control-examples?

HTH Urs

jmmmp schrieb:

...

Hello, did I miss something in the help files, or it isn't possible yet to
change dinamically the vertical values of an array through message
commands? (as opposite to the horizontal size) would anyone consider this feature useful even for the standard version
of pd? Joao --

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Setting the range is possible, but I suppose you want to enforce the range as well, right?, so that it it not possible anymore to move a value outside the array box with the mouse?

it was just to set the range, but as I said, I didn't looked at it closely
enough. now I know how to do it.

This indeed is not possible to enforce with Pd, however I don't see why this should have anything to do with arrays being designed for audio data. Arrays are not thought to be for audio data only, they are general purpose, well, arrays.

that I also wrote too fast: of course an array is just an array. I meant
to say that since arrays have as standard the boundaries between -1 and 1,
it is more common for them to be used for audio. but of course, we're in a
democracy, an array can do what he pleases.

Ah, now I can understand your problem much better. Anyway for displaying envelopes you might also want to try out data structures, which can look a bit nicer, depending on what you want to achieve.

thanks for the suggestion. I'll try it when I have the time to study this
field better. for me are data structures still quite unstructured.

ähmm, are you sure you have looked at
2.control.examples/16.more.arrays.pd ?

as far as i can tell the "bounds" message is exactly what you are looking for.

oops, I'm sorry. that's exactly what I wanted. I knew that I had done
something with that, and I didn't remembered anymore. and I did looked at
both array help patches, but it wasn't enough.

the only weird thing is the order of arguments: [bounds <Xmin> <Ymax> <Xmax> <Ymin>( (i guess this is due to the constant turning the graph upside down: if your origin is the upper-left corner of the screen, you will have [bounds <Xmin> <Ymin> <Xmax> <Ymax>(, but unfortunately we are so used to having the Y-axis pointing upwards)

so:

[bounds 0 128 100 0( | [s array]