i really don't remember who brought that thing of 'end of computer music' on that list, i would mainly say, it's no good to limit oneself to computer music, and generally for me, it's not enough.
i'm glad you quote Tarkowski and not another *kowski...
i like pan sonic
i like luc ferrari
i like savage republic
i'm going to see napalm death..
( just in case someone is lost )
and i never said my taste was the absolute one...
your arguments are not bad, but soo long, i just understood you would like a more physical interaction with the computer.
saludos, sevy
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:39 PM, ydegoyon@gmail.com ydegoyon@gmail.comwrote:
i like luc ferrari
About 10-12 years ago I took Luc to a Chicago house club. He was really into dance music in the 90s, and not so much into 'computer music'. He was getting more inspiration from going to clubs than anything from IRCAM or GRM.
of course music has to do with body and feedbacks ; knowing that the arbitrary distance between body and mind is quite cultural, what about cyborgs and cyborg's bodies ? fred
chris clepper wrote:
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:39 PM, ydegoyon@gmail.com mailto:ydegoyon@gmail.com <ydegoyon@gmail.com mailto:ydegoyon@gmail.com> wrote:
i like luc ferrariAbout 10-12 years ago I took Luc to a Chicago house club. He was really into dance music in the 90s, and not so much into 'computer music'. He was getting more inspiration from going to clubs than anything from IRCAM or GRM.
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
hola
thx for your thoughtful post.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 PM, Fernando Gadea fgadea@gmail.com wrote:
1- physical instruments
well, yes; body, rhythm, instruments, music.
but i think there is also something interesting in 'mental' music. or music that is achieved only through programming sounds. like those old vienese [and of course other places too] used to do with paper and pen ...
2- About academic-high culture-Art and popular-low culture-art
this is a religious war- completely outside the bounds of rationality. and really, i don't care which 'club' an artist comes from: i just want their work to captivate me.
what makes something art? how do we know if it is any good? there are no laws about this. people assert them periodically, but they are soon enough forgotten.
Hey guys,
I just wanna say that in terms of live computer music, to me lack of physical interaction makes it totally boring for me. When I've mentioned this to some artists who's 'live performance' consists of them staring at a computer screen hitting buttons-maybe there'll be some arbitrary visual display if I'm lucky-I could tell they were thinking 'Philistine! go see a Pink concert if you want to see someone compensating for a complete lack of musical talent, artistry or substance with a dazzling live performance complete with the obligatory crowd-clapping breakdown-I'm solely and purely about the MUSIC being created, and if you were too, the sound would be enough for you'.
But I reckon this attitude is, if I may be so bold, BULLSHIT. If that's your attitude fine, but in that case what's the point of a live performance at all (needless to say I'm not talking about installations or spatialised pieces)? When I go see a live performance, I wanna see someone creating the music, and to me, that means physically creating it in some way. I wanna see that their emotions or concentration or whatever is being used in their act of creation is so intense that I can see physical manifestations of it through their physical actions. I think the area of MIDIcontroller technology is so ignored, probably cause there's no market fo it cause of that dumb attitude. I wish someone would come up with some interesting physical controller that actually requires substantial physical effort to manipulate parameters, or at least could withstand and respond to it.
At the end of the day I don't think a live performance IS about the music, no matter how good-it's about seeing someone pour themselves into creating music you like, seeing their effort and passion in every action they perform, and most importantly hearing those actions effect on the sound being produced. If I were King, I'd be taking advantage of computer musical capabilities to make physical instruments/controllers that take MORE physical actions than any actual acoustic/electric instrument could require-MUCH more. I dream of having a set-up where I have to run around, smashing stuff with hammers, pushing giant sliders with all my strength, etc-now THAT would be a live performance I'd enjoy.
Let's get physical, and stop kidding ourselves-it matters ( . . . for live performance).
Babsyco.
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 09:24:55 -0400 From: js0000@gmail.com To: fgadea@gmail.com CC: pd-list@iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
hola
thx for your thoughtful post.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 PM, Fernando Gadea fgadea@gmail.com wrote:
1- physical instruments
well, yes; body, rhythm, instruments, music.
but i think there is also something interesting in 'mental' music. or music that is achieved only through programming sounds. like those old vienese [and of course other places too] used to do with paper and pen ...
2- About academic-high culture-Art and popular-low culture-art
this is a religious war- completely outside the bounds of rationality. and really, i don't care which 'club' an artist comes fro i just want their work to captivate me.
what makes something art? how do we know if it is any good? there are no laws about this. people assert them periodically, but they are soon enough forgotten.
-- \js [ - . . . ]
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Take a peek at other people's pay and perks Check out The Great Australian Pay Check http://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/157639755/direct/01/
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 14:43:49 +0000 babsyco babsyco babsyco@hotmail.com wrote:
If that's your attitude fine, but in that case what's the point of a live performance at all
It's an fair question. The answer to that, for those of us that do livecoding type perfomances, is the accompanying visual display (usually back projected on a large screen) that lays bare the cognitive, rather than gestural/physical process.
In this regard I take 'performance' to mean a demonstration of authenticity.
Of course it's a narrow audience able to apprreciate what is going on, but it is a legitimate performance that exposes the artist to scrutiny, I dare say at least as much as playing a guitar, and more than playing a keyboard where your hands are hidden and nobody can be sure whether you are miming to a tape or sequence as so many popular artists do.
a.
Hi Babsyco
You'll probably enjoy this guy's work : http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2009/09/tristan_shones_sound_machines.html?...
De : babsyco babsyco babsyco@hotmail.com À : pd-list@iem.at Envoyé le : Mercredi, 9 Septembre 2009, 16h43mn 49s Objet : Re: [PD] "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
Hey guys,
I just wanna say that in terms of live computer music, to me lack of physical interaction makes it totally boring for me. When I've mentioned this to some artists who's 'live performance' consists of them staring at a computer screen hitting buttons-maybe there'll be some arbitrary visual display if I'm lucky-I could tell they were thinking 'Philistine! go see a Pink concert if you want to see someone compensating for a complete lack of musical talent, artistry or substance with a dazzling live performance complete with the obligatory crowd-clapping breakdown-I'm solely and purely about the MUSIC being created, and if you were too, the sound would be enough for you'.
But I reckon this attitude is, if I may be so bold, BULLSHIT. If that's your attitude fine, but in that case what's the point of a live performance at all (needless to say I'm not talking about installations or spatialised pieces)? When I go see a live performance, I wanna see someone creating the music, and to me, that means physically creating it in some way. I wanna see that their emotions or concentration or whatever is being used in their act of creation is so intense that I can see physical manifestations of it through their physical actions. I think the area of MIDIcontroller technology is so ignored, probably cause there's no market fo it cause of that dumb attitude. I wish someone would come up with some interesting physical controller that actually requires substantial physical effort to manipulate parameters, or at least could withstand and respond to it.
At the end of the day I don't think a live performance IS about the music, no matter how good-it's about seeing someone pour themselves into creating music you like, seeing their effort and passion in every action they perform, and most importantly hearing those actions effect on the sound being produced. If I were King, I'd be taking advantage of computer musical capabilities to make physical instruments/controllers that take MORE physical actions than any actual acoustic/electric instrument could require-MUCH more. I dream of having a set-up where I have to run around, smashing stuff with hammers, pushing giant sliders with all my strength, etc-now THAT would be a live performance I'd enjoy.
Let's get physical, and stop kidding ourselves-it matters ( . . . for live performance).
Babsyco.
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 09:24:55 -0400 From: js0000@gmail.com To: fgadea@gmail.com CC: pd-list@iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
hola
thx for your thoughtful post.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 PM, Fernando Gadea fgadea@gmail.com wrote:
1- physical instruments
well, yes; body, rhythm, instruments, music.
but i think there is also something interesting in 'mental' music. or music that is achieved only through programming sounds. like those old vienese [and of course other places too] used to do with paper and pen ...
2- About academic-high culture-Art and popular-low culture-art
this is a religious war- completely outside the bounds of rationality. and really, i don't care which 'club' an artist comes fro i just want their work to captivate me.
what makes something art? how do we know if it is any good? there are no laws about this. people assert them periodically, but they are soon enough forgotten.
-- \js [ - . . . ]
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Check out The Great Australian Pay Check Take a peek at other people's pay and perks
Hey Thanks! I did enjoy that-not so much the music, but those are the kind of controllers I mean-why aren't they popular, or even available? I think being able to be as physical as possible in producing music would be such a liberating experience-to feel like you're physically sculpting the music. Tristan Shone's on the right track if you ask me.
Even some kind of hand held rubiks cube type thing with a bit or resistance, with bits you have to turn and buttons you have to push hard on, etc, would be fun-no need to resemble existing instruments at all.
And Andy Farnell, thanks and I can understand how a multimedia display that 'demonstrates authenticity' does justify a live event, though in terms of comparing it to guitar or keys, I don't know if I enjoy going to see a live concert to see someone prove can play something. I go to see them produce music I like-see being the main word. I understand that it's just a different world-all I'm saying is that in my opinion physicality matters a great deal in performance and I wish more computer artists would take it seriously.
I think even those who appreciate the multimedia display component would enjoy seeing the performer more physically active, and valid though the multimedia display may be, I don't think it compensates for what I get from seeing the physical actions and hearing the resulting sound-I think they're two very differnet components of a performance. In any case, I can't see a reason why the two have to be mutually exclusive. Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 19:42:51 +0000 From: dwanafite@yahoo.fr To: pd-list@iem.at Subject: [PD] Re : "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
Hi Babsyco
You'll probably enjoy this guy's work : http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2009/09/tristan_shones_sound_machines.html?...
De : babsyco babsyco babsyco@hotmail.com À : pd-list@iem.at Envoyé le : Mercredi, 9 Septembre 2009, 16h43mn 49s Objet : Re: [PD] "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
Hey guys,
I just wanna say that in terms of live computer music, to me lack of physical interaction makes it totally boring for me. When I've mentioned this to some artists who's 'live performance' consists of them staring at a computer screen hitting buttons-maybe there'll be some arbitrary visual display if I'm lucky-I could tell they were thinking 'Philistine! go see a Pink concert if you want to see someone compensating for a complete lack of musical talent, artistry or substance with a dazzling live performance complete with the obligatory crowd-clapping breakdown-I'm solely and purely about the MUSIC being created, and if you were too, the sound would be enough for you'.
But I reckon this attitude is, if I may be so bold, BULLSHIT. If that's your attitude fine, but in that case what's the point of a live performance at all (needless to say I'm not talking about installations or spatialised pieces)? When I go see a live performance, I wanna see someone creating the music, and to me, that means physically creating it in some way. I wanna see that their emotions or concentration or whatever is being used in their act of creation is so intense that I can see physical manifestations of it through their physical actions. I think the area of MIDIcontroller technology is so ignored, probably cause there's no market fo it cause of that dumb attitude. I wish someone would come up with some interesting physical controller that actually requires substantial physical effort to manipulate parameters, or at least could withstand and respond to it.
At the end of the day I don't think a live performance IS about the music, no matter how good-it's about seeing someone pour themselves into creating music you like, seeing their effort and passion in every action they perform, and most importantly hearing those actions effect on the sound being produced. If I were King, I'd be taking advantage of computer musical capabilities to make physical instruments/controllers that take MORE physical actions than any actual acoustic/electric instrument could require-MUCH more. I dream of having a set-up where I have to run around, smashing stuff with hammers, pushing giant sliders with all my strength, etc-now THAT would be a live performance I'd enjoy.
Let's get physical, and stop kidding ourselves-it matters ( . . . for live performance).
Babsyco.
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 09:24:55 -0400 From: js0000@gmail.com To: fgadea@gmail.com CC: pd-list@iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] "computer music" WAS: Re: Pd at a livecoding event on the BBC
hola
thx for your thoughtful post.
On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 PM, Fernando Gadea fgadea@gmail.com wrote:
1- physical instruments
well, yes; body, rhythm, instruments,
music.
but i think there is also something interesting in 'mental' music. or music that is achieved only through programming sounds. like those old vienese [and of course other places too] used to do with paper and pen ...
2- About academic-high culture-Art and popular-low culture-art
this is a religious war- completely outside the bounds of rationality. and really, i don't care which 'club' an artist comes fro i just want their work to captivate me.
what makes something art? how do we know if it is any good? there are no laws about this. people assert them periodically, but they are soon enough forgotten.
-- \js [ - . . . ]
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Check out The Great Australian Pay Check Take a peek at other people's pay and perks
Get Hotmail on your iPhone Find out how here http://windowslive.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=845706
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 10:27 PM, babsyco babsyco babsyco@hotmail.com wrote:
Even some kind of hand held rubiks cube type thing with a bit or resistance, with bits you have to turn and buttons you have to push hard on, etc, would be fun-no need to resemble existing instruments at all.
http://artificiel.kitmobile.info/mov/artificielCubing_mm09_05min_h.264_800kb...
./MiS
-
Andy Farnell -
babsyco babsyco -
chris clepper -
dwanafite -
Fernando Gadea -
fred-ordi -
john saylor -
Michal Seta -
ydegoyon＠gmail.com