Hi,
finally got internet working on my ubuntu (desktop), so I might start
setting up stuff here to try to move from one system to the other. For
that I would like to ask some advice, if anyone has nothing better to do.
My system is:
- laptop thinkpad, i386 32b
- desktop thinkcentre i686 64b
- rme multiface + card (using with laptop, most probably will use with
both computers)
- pd extended (don't use much pd-van these days)
Each computer has the same sytems: XP + Ubuntu (and will keep having,
except for the bit difference). They'll be used for audio (not much video
going on here besides watching a dvd).
What do you think might be the better approach, to use ubuntu normal, or
ubuntustudio? Roman told me that for a while there's no big difference,
because the -rt kernel comes with ubuntu. Is ubuntustudio more than a
bundle of software with nice backgrounds? (Note: I'll use the same setup
on both computers, so the system should work on 64 and 32b).
Another note: what window managers do you advise? I find the simple,
low-cal approach of fluxbox / enlightenment better as the sugar-puffed
gnome etc. Any remarks against using any of these? By the way, one of the
things that puts me off of linux is that it takes so much *'%$ time to get
going. So, reliability is also a parameter.
Thanks,
João Pais
PS: Don't know if it was noticed, but some days ago I sent out another
abstraction,
http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067044.html. Or maybe
it was noticed enough.
What do you think might be the better approach, to use ubuntu normal, or
ubuntustudio? Roman told me that for a while there's no big difference,
because the -rt kernel comes with ubuntu. Is ubuntustudio more than a
bundle of software with nice backgrounds? (Note: I'll use the same setup
on both computers, so the system should work on 64 and 32b).
As far as I know, "Studio" is just plain Ubuntu that comes with a set of software relevant to audio & video. As a matter of fact, installing the "studio (or a name of that sort)" meta package on plain Ubuntu is the same as starting out with a "studio" installation CD/DVD.
Probably it is just the matter of preference in images used for the startup screen and the default wall paper.
-- David Shimamoto
PSPunch escribió:
What do you think might be the better approach, to use ubuntu normal, or
ubuntustudio? Roman told me that for a while there's no big difference,
because the -rt kernel comes with ubuntu. Is ubuntustudio more than a
bundle of software with nice backgrounds? (Note: I'll use the same setup
on both computers, so the system should work on 64 and 32b).As far as I know, "Studio" is just plain Ubuntu that comes with a set of
software relevant to audio & video.
They use different kernel. Ubutustudio have a specific kernel for real time, and maybe (I'm not sure) a problem with firewire bus. my two cents Husk
Hi,
The great advantage of using linux is that we can have a choice of installed applications. If there are many computers to setup and if ubuntustudio is compatible with all the computers, the gain of installing time would be so relevant. On a single computer, I don't see the point of installing all the stuff from DVD or META-PACKAGE, if it's about using less than ten per cent of the proposed applications, all the stuff inside this distribution is well documented, why not just taking what is needed?
husk a écrit :
PSPunch escribió:
What do you think might be the better approach, to use ubuntu normal, or
ubuntustudio? Roman told me that for a while there's no big difference,
because the -rt kernel comes with ubuntu. Is ubuntustudio more than a
bundle of software with nice backgrounds? (Note: I'll use the same setup
on both computers, so the system should work on 64 and 32b).As far as I know, "Studio" is just plain Ubuntu that comes with a set of
software relevant to audio & video.
They use different kernel. Ubutustudio have a specific kernel for real time, and maybe (I'm not sure) a problem with firewire bus. my two cents Husk
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PSPunch(e)k dio:
What do you think might be the better approach, to use ubuntu normal, or
ubuntustudio? Roman told me that for a while there's no big difference,
because the -rt kernel comes with ubuntu. Is ubuntustudio more than a
bundle of software with nice backgrounds? (Note: I'll use the same setup
on both computers, so the system should work on 64 and 32b).As far as I know, "Studio" is just plain Ubuntu that comes with a set of software relevant to audio & video. As a matter of fact, installing the "studio (or a name of that sort)" meta package on plain Ubuntu is the same as starting out with a "studio" installation CD/DVD.
Probably it is just the matter of preference in images used for the startup screen and the default wall paper.
i think there is something else than just the kernel and packages. some tweaks on the configuration that the plain Ubuntu does not have, stuff like memory use, priorities and groups + permissions. But i think all can be done by hand.
enrike
Hi!
If you are really lazy, take Ubuntustudio with LTS (8.04). And do not change 8.04 to 8.10 (or other) untill next LTS release. Or switch to 8.10 when 9.04 will be near-ready. With normal release (not LTS) you'll get pissed off twice a year "just because" you'll loose your software untill someone will make packages for you (developers wait with packaging untill last moment or longer, everything can change with every beta release and it may cause errors, as it was with pd-extended and Intrepid AFAIR). And you'll have to wait some time to get your packages done. Every version now is a major rewrite, so using LTS is the only way to have your packages quite fresh and in working condition without much effort.
You can also consider other, audio- media- or pd-oriented distros (or distros supported with packages of what-you-need and/or rt kernel), Musix, dyne:bolic and pure:dyne come to my mind. Or tweaked Debian (pure:dyne?). With d:b please wait for upcoming release, 2.5.2 is very crude now.
I'm in general very pissed off with Ubuntu. It is fat and it breaks my toys. I have to compile tones of stuff every half a year. It is not always possible to compile it all... I'm under Slack now. But I don't need rt kernel. It is possible to install rt in any major distro.
You always have to choose if it is: specialised (Musix) or general-purpose (*buntu*, Fedora, OpenSUSE, Debian), fat, but out-of-the-box (OpenSUSE, *buntu*) or light, but DIY-ish (Slackware), modern (*buntu*) or with clear and obvious UNIX-like, well documented architecture (Debian, Slack) installed ONCE, forever (almost any mature release), stable (Slack, Debian - stable branch), slightly unstable, but with newer software (Ubuntu, Debian testing) or in beta stage - with newest tools but almost always something cracks (Ubuntu beta releases, Debian sid) ready to use out-of-the-box (in your case - specialized distros only), after a short while (ubuntustudio or any bigget thing with rt kernel in packages) or after heavy tweaking (installing/compiling/gathering/tweaking software, kernel, desktop env., hardware recognition and many others - like in Gentoo or Slackware). have such fancy thing like mounting your pendrive or camera in easy way, integrated mixer, network reckognition tools (avahi), so KDE, Gnome or Xfce-based or lightweight (fluxbox, IceWM). enlightenment - 17 - sorry, but I think it is unusable (I've tried it last month), it needs much more work to simply do the job with it. 16 is good.
After you'll answer to yourself - the choice will be much easyier. In my case I needed something: easy on resources stable, not so modern, but reliable software, to have live performances and many hours of efficient work without ventricular hypertension. (I'm still quite happy with Gimp 2.4) to set up once a year or two or three, with mid-size repository, with my must-have software working in 100% (It is a nomadic graphic station, so Gimp, Inkscape, Cinelerra, Scribus, Fontmatrix, Veejay, PD-vanilla, Processing and Synfig Studio is a must, with java and python software) to have pendrive, camera and tablet working in reasonable time to have my wireless card supported with high connectivity (I'm a wireless safety tester too) and some network tools (ftp client and Skype) easy to repair or tweak in ANY possible way when needed, so well documented, clear and clean in terms of architecture. easy to compile stuff on it
So Slack with KDE was the one. Debian is pretty good but it is developed much too fast for me. With Slack my tools are supported within few years. Or I can compile things on my own. Settings, additional packages, tweaks are left untouched after reinstallation, which is also a big plus. I have plenty of time (I'm working on of 1/4 full time), so having my tablet working in three days and camera in two was OK for me. This should be ready out-of-the-box, but whatever... I also like the mind-bending style of Slackware configuration, it teaches a lot.
Cheers, Luke
thanks for your replies.
I really don't have much free time (sometimes the free time is already
scheduled), and am not a bash/unix guru (although I'm not that dumb). but
I really don't have the time/pacience to go (again!!) to visit x forums to
know why this flag gives an error while compiling/building, what happens
to the guy that has the computer model 1234x while I have the model 1234y,
... you know the drill.
so, I think I'll stick with ubuntu 8.10, install the -rt kernel (through
synaptic), and install all programs separately (no studio-bundle): jack,
PDs, ardour, hdsp+multiface ...
(by the way, I also have a tablet. but I have already some installation
guides from 7.04)
btw, I also wanted to use the rme hdsp card on my desktop - must just get
a pci-pcmcia adapter. Does any of you has anything to warn against this?
thanks again,
João
Hi!
If you are really lazy, take Ubuntustudio with LTS (8.04). And do not change 8.04 to 8.10 (or other) untill next LTS release. Or switch to 8.10 when 9.04 will be near-ready. With normal release (not LTS) you'll get pissed off twice a year "just because" you'll loose your software untill someone will make packages for you (developers wait with packaging untill last moment or longer, everything can change with every beta release and it may cause errors, as it was with pd-extended and Intrepid AFAIR). And you'll have to wait some time to get your packages done. Every version now is a major rewrite, so using LTS is the only way to have your packages quite fresh and in working condition without much effort.
You can also consider other, audio- media- or pd-oriented distros (or distros supported with packages of what-you-need and/or rt kernel), Musix, dyne:bolic and pure:dyne come to my mind. Or tweaked Debian (pure:dyne?). With d:b please wait for upcoming release, 2.5.2 is very crude now.
I'm in general very pissed off with Ubuntu. It is fat and it breaks my toys. I have to compile tones of stuff every half a year. It is not always possible to compile it all... I'm under Slack now. But I don't need rt kernel. It is possible to install rt in any major distro.
You always have to choose if it is: specialised (Musix) or general-purpose (*buntu*, Fedora, OpenSUSE,
Debian), fat, but out-of-the-box (OpenSUSE, *buntu*) or light, but DIY-ish
(Slackware), modern (*buntu*) or with clear and obvious UNIX-like, well documented architecture (Debian, Slack) installed ONCE, forever (almost any mature release), stable (Slack, Debian - stable branch), slightly unstable, but with newer software (Ubuntu, Debian testing) or in beta stage - with newest tools but almost always something cracks (Ubuntu beta releases, Debian sid) ready to use out-of-the-box (in your case - specialized distros only), after a short while (ubuntustudio or any bigget thing with rt kernel in packages) or after heavy tweaking (installing/compiling/gathering/tweaking software, kernel, desktop env., hardware recognition and many others - like in Gentoo or Slackware). have such fancy thing like mounting your pendrive or camera in easy way, integrated mixer, network reckognition tools (avahi), so KDE, Gnome or Xfce-based or lightweight (fluxbox, IceWM). enlightenment - 17 - sorry, but I think it is unusable (I've tried it last month), it needs much more work to simply do the job with it. 16 is good.After you'll answer to yourself - the choice will be much easyier. In my case I needed something: easy on resources stable, not so modern, but reliable software, to have live performances and many hours of efficient work without ventricular hypertension. (I'm still quite happy with Gimp 2.4) to set up once a year or two or three, with mid-size repository, with my must-have software working in 100% (It is a nomadic graphic station, so Gimp, Inkscape, Cinelerra, Scribus, Fontmatrix, Veejay, PD-vanilla, Processing and Synfig Studio is a must, with java and python software) to have pendrive, camera and tablet working in reasonable time to have my wireless card supported with high connectivity (I'm a wireless safety tester too) and some network tools (ftp client and Skype) easy to repair or tweak in ANY possible way when needed, so well documented, clear and clean in terms of architecture. easy to compile stuff on it
So Slack with KDE was the one. Debian is pretty good but it is developed much too fast for me. With Slack my tools are supported within few years. Or I can compile things on my own. Settings, additional packages, tweaks are left untouched after reinstallation, which is also a big plus. I have plenty of time (I'm working on of 1/4 full time), so having my tablet working in three days and camera in two was OK for me. This should be ready out-of-the-box, but whatever... I also like the mind-bending style of Slackware configuration, it teaches a lot.
Cheers, Luke
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On Sun, 2009-01-04 at 13:39 +0100, João Pais wrote:
btw, I also wanted to use the rme hdsp card on my desktop - must just get
a pci-pcmcia adapter. Does any of you has anything to warn against this?
a quick search showed me, that those adapters cost only a few bucks and have support for "Cardbus 32 bits & PCMCIA 16 bits Cards", while the the original rme pci breakout box costs several hundred bucks, so i'd say its definitely worth a try. if you go this route, i am definitely interested to know the results.
roman
Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de
I will try it at some point, just don't know yet how long it will take. If something doesn't work, you'll get a whining mail for sure.
2009/1/4 Roman Haefeli reduzierer@yahoo.de
On Sun, 2009-01-04 at 13:39 +0100, João Pais wrote:
btw, I also wanted to use the rme hdsp card on my desktop - must just get a pci-pcmcia adapter. Does any of you has anything to warn against this?
a quick search showed me, that those adapters cost only a few bucks and have support for "Cardbus 32 bits & PCMCIA 16 bits Cards", while the the original rme pci breakout box costs several hundred bucks, so i'd say its definitely worth a try. if you go this route, i am definitely interested to know the results.
roman
Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de
On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 01:38:58PM +0100, João Pais wrote:
Another note: what window managers do you advise? I find the simple,
low-cal approach of fluxbox / enlightenment better as the sugar-puffed
gnome etc. Any remarks against using any of these? By the way, one of the
things that puts me off of linux is that it takes so much *'%$ time to get
going. So, reliability is also a parameter.
Agree about the time thing under Linux. I was a longtime blackbox and then fluxbox addict, but I've gone soft in my old age and use Xfce now. It's about as fast (maybe faster) and configurable as fluxbox but gives you some of the nice features of Gnome and friends, without the bloat. The bloat is actually optional as you can elect to start gnome and kde services on startup, but you don't need them at all to function. Also, you don't have to edit any config files if you don't want to. Additionally, Linux finally got a file browser that doesn't suck (it's about as good as Explorer.exe) in Thunar, Xfce's default file browser.
apt-get install xfce4
Chris.
This e-mail maybe be coming a little late, but just wanted to add my two cents, maybe for future list searchers.
I'm running Ubuntu Studio now, but have run vanilla Ubuntu as well and didn't really notice a performance difference. I DID like having lots of audio things preinstalled...I didn't need to waste a lot of time getting my audio-specific hardware up and running, just plug and play, and then start removing unnecessary junk when bored, instead of frantically looking for things when I have a project to get done. Supposedly, Studio is also "optimized" for studio work, but I haven't actually spent the time to look into what exactly that means. If you're already running vanilla, I wouldn't switch over unless you find a very compelling reason to do so.
-Michael
On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Chris McCormick chris@mccormick.cx wrote:
On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 01:38:58PM +0100, João Pais wrote:
Another note: what window managers do you advise? I find the simple, low-cal approach of fluxbox / enlightenment better as the sugar-puffed gnome etc. Any remarks against using any of these? By the way, one of the things that puts me off of linux is that it takes so much *'%$ time to get going. So, reliability is also a parameter.
Agree about the time thing under Linux. I was a longtime blackbox and then fluxbox addict, but I've gone soft in my old age and use Xfce now. It's about as fast (maybe faster) and configurable as fluxbox but gives you some of the nice features of Gnome and friends, without the bloat. The bloat is actually optional as you can elect to start gnome and kde services on startup, but you don't need them at all to function. Also, you don't have to edit any config files if you don't want to. Additionally, Linux finally got a file browser that doesn't suck (it's about as good as Explorer.exe) in Thunar, Xfce's default file browser.
apt-get install xfce4Chris.
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altern -
Chris McCormick -
husk -
João Pais -
Lukasz Jastrzebski -
Patrice Colet -
PSPunch -
Roman Haefeli -
Tomato Thaumato