Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
cheers,
nav
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Hallo, navz@dreaming.org hat gesagt: // navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
I run 2.6 and "pd -rt" without problems on both my machines, laptop and stationary.
ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
hello list, it's been a while...
anyhow, has anyone been able to confirm, deny, or preferably shed some light on this 2.6 + -rt hang problem?
i am just now trying to get my machine performance-capable again after moving two 2.6 quite a while ago, and i have come across the same problem.
i have tried with the latest cvs, and (probably a more useful benchmark) millers 0.37-1 release.
i have tried kernels with pre-emption both turned on and off, since that sounded like something that might trigger it, but both kernels hung.
i am running only with alsa at the moment, but i noticed that pd still hangs even if running "pd -rt -noaudio".
i'm running ext3. i faintly remember there being some filesystem related realtime problems in some 2.4 kernels. is there any chance these fixes didn't make their way into 2.6?
i'm running 2.6.5... but i also got these hangs under 2.6.3.
pix.
On Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:48:34 +0100 Frank Barknecht fbar@footils.org wrote:
Hallo, navz@dreaming.org hat gesagt: // navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
I run 2.6 and "pd -rt" without problems on both my machines, laptop and stationary.
ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
hi all,
i've finally been able to run my hdsp ...
but still i experience some problems when using the hdsp with pd: i can only run either jack or pd with in realtime mode. if i run both: watchdog: signaling pd...
i don't know if it's related to the problem you were describing, but since it might be similar, i add it to this thread... (i'm using kernel 2.6.6_rc2)
oss (alsa layer) works fine ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
Hallo, Tim Blechmann hat gesagt: // Tim Blechmann wrote:
i've finally been able to run my hdsp ...
Finally!!! Congratulations.
but still i experience some problems when using the hdsp with pd: i can only run either jack or pd with in realtime mode. if i run both: watchdog: signaling pd...
Okay, this is one I know. You probably run the devel version. Please try the MSP official one, and if this fixes it, then devel misses one tiny patch, which you might find in the list archives.
The thing might be, that Pd runs at a higher priority than jackd, which isn't good, and also, that Pd will issue a non-realtime safe error message in it's jack process function. This has to be removed.
Ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
On Wed, 5 May 2004, Frank Barknecht wrote:
but still i experience some problems when using the hdsp with pd: i can only run either jack or pd with in realtime mode. if i run both: watchdog: signaling pd...
Okay, this is one I know. You probably run the devel version.
If you run an old version (either devel or miller) this might explain the behaviour. If not, I would really like to figure out what is happening. Thomas Charbonnel, maintainer of the RME HDSP driver told me at the ZKM meeting that it would not pay off to include ALSA support for the HDSP in PD, because JACK is working perfectly and offers so many advantages.
Guenter
Please try the MSP official one, and if this fixes it, then devel misses one tiny patch, which you might find in the list archives.
The thing might be, that Pd runs at a higher priority than jackd, which isn't good, and also, that Pd will issue a non-realtime safe error message in it's jack process function. This has to be removed.
Ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
If you run an old version (either devel or miller) this might explain the behaviour. If not, I would really like to figure out what is happening. Thomas Charbonnel, maintainer of the RME HDSP driver told me at the ZKM meeting that it would not pay off to include ALSA support for the HDSP in PD, because JACK is working perfectly and offers so many advantages.
well, thomas was probably right about this, but since pd supports all 3 api's for linux audio hardware, it's not really good, if some hardware can only be accessed by specific api's ... (the hdsp only with jack / oss, some usb audio devices only with oss...)
since jack became the standard, it is probably the way to go, but as long as alsa is still supported by pd, we should try to support most cards including the hdsp ... (i hope, thomas finds his patch, so that we can add it to the cvs...)
the patch, frank wrote about, was only in miller's branch, not in the cvs. i added it and it works fine now ... thanks for the hint ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
the patch, frank wrote about, was only in miller's branch, not in the cvs. i added it and it works fine now ... thanks for the hint ...
sorry for this stupid message ... it seems that my local copy of the cvs branch wasn't in sync with the cvs ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
On Thu, 6 May 2004, Tim Blechmann wrote:
the patch, frank wrote about, was only in miller's branch, not in the cvs. i added it and it works fine now ... thanks for the hint ...
sorry for this stupid message ... it seems that my local copy of the cvs branch wasn't in sync with the cvs ...
I was wondering, because miller adoped it from the CVS in a slightly changed version. Anyhow, I patched in millers changes form 0.37.1, so we would be up and running again on CVS. The next task would be to sort out the changes in the devel_0_37 into separate patches comment them and present them to Miller in digestible portions, as we discussed at the LAD meeting. Prob a task for the weekend.
Guenter
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
I was wondering, because miller adoped it from the CVS in a slightly changed version. Anyhow, I patched in millers changes form 0.37.1,
ah, that's why i missed the update... ;-)
so we would be up and running again on CVS. The next task would be to sort out the changes in the devel_0_37 into separate patches comment them and present them to Miller in digestible portions, as we discussed at the LAD meeting. Prob a task for the weekend.
i've already sent him two of my patches (fftw, comments in .pdrc files)
i haven't had the time to look at yves' threaded gui stuff. since i'm not using osx or win ... they are using the pthread library. is this library available for other platforms than linux? if not, i'll need to have a look at it, again ...
yves wrote another patch to provide a threaded soundfiler. i thought about this and a message from thomas grill a few monthes ago, proposing to lock the arrays in a mutex or adding a global queue for array operations. i haven't had a look at yves' patch, but it might be a good idea to rewrite the soundfiler according to thomas' proposals ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
Hi Guenter,
guenter geiger wrote:
Thomas Charbonnel, maintainer of the RME HDSP driver told me at the ZKM meeting that it would not pay off to include ALSA support for the HDSP in PD, because JACK is working perfectly and offers so many advantages.
I would like to suggest that you disregard Thomas' advice. ALSA is now standard for 2.6 kernels, and throwing away the choice of using it straight seems like only limiting options rather than giving advantages.
Two examples:
- Basic: new users just trying out PD and/or Linux might not have
everything configured for properly using Jack. In fact, when doing workshop with all the kinds of cheap hardware and crappy motherboard soundcards you usually get at workshops, there have been plenty of times when Jack simply would not run at all! Forcing these people to rely on the emulation of a depreciated sound system doesn't really sound like such a good idea.
- Advanced: what if I wanted to use PD + HDSP for an installation, for
example, which autostarts if the computer for some reason gets rebooted? Instead of a simple prompt to open PD, I would have to make a whole shell script to start the jack daemon, then start PD, then connect all the ports in Jack *before* starting the DSP in PD. Not much advantage there...
And for the record, I get the same exact stream of PD watchdog messages, which I have posted to this list already, as Tim does with both 2.4 and 2.6 kernels.
ok... I think I have run out of technical problems to complain about to this list tonight ;-) Think I'll go to bed, and get back to making noise tomorrow.
Best, d.
And for the record, I get the same exact stream of PD watchdog messages, which I have posted to this list already, as Tim does with both 2.4 and 2.6 kernels.
guenter merged the changes from 0.37-1 to the cvs a few days ago, which included the realtime scheduling patch with jack ... so it should be
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
On Fri, 7 May 2004, derek holzer wrote:
I would like to suggest that you disregard Thomas' advice. ALSA is now standard for 2.6 kernels, and throwing away the choice of using it straight seems like only limiting options rather than giving advantages.
Hmm, ok, point taken, although I do not agree fully with all of your reasoning. I still have to find the time to reintroduce the working version s_alsa.c in a recent pd version. If someone wants to give it a try, just take s_alsa from the devel_0_36 branch and adapt it to pd 0.37 changed audio structure. As long as I don't have a HDSP card I might not find the motivation to do so. I am sorry, I am terribly lazy :(
Guenter
Two examples:
- Basic: new users just trying out PD and/or Linux might not have
everything configured for properly using Jack. In fact, when doing workshop with all the kinds of cheap hardware and crappy motherboard soundcards you usually get at workshops, there have been plenty of times when Jack simply would not run at all! Forcing these people to rely on the emulation of a depreciated sound system doesn't really sound like such a good idea.
- Advanced: what if I wanted to use PD + HDSP for an installation, for
example, which autostarts if the computer for some reason gets rebooted? Instead of a simple prompt to open PD, I would have to make a whole shell script to start the jack daemon, then start PD, then connect all the ports in Jack *before* starting the DSP in PD. Not much advantage there...
And for the record, I get the same exact stream of PD watchdog messages, which I have posted to this list already, as Tim does with both 2.4 and 2.6 kernels.
ok... I think I have run out of technical problems to complain about to this list tonight ;-) Think I'll go to bed, and get back to making noise tomorrow.
Best, d.
-- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ---Oblique Strategy # 45: "Disciplined self-indulgence"
As long as I don't have a HDSP card I might not find the motivation to do so. I am sorry, I am terribly lazy :(
thomas charbonnel told me, that he ported pd's old alsa part to 0.37 ... i hope he still has these files arround ... it would save us some work ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de ICQ: 96771783 -- The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes "Awww!" Jack Kerouac
hey frank, what version of tcl/tk are you using?
i noticed i get this hang even if i just run pd as root, even without the -rt switch.
pix.
On Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:48:34 +0100 Frank Barknecht fbar@footils.org wrote:
Hallo, navz@dreaming.org hat gesagt: // navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
I run 2.6 and "pd -rt" without problems on both my machines, laptop and stationary.
ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
Also, it might matter whether or not you're running Jack and/or ALSA...
Miller
On Tue, May 04, 2004 at 02:33:42AM +0200, pix wrote:
hey frank, what version of tcl/tk are you using?
i noticed i get this hang even if i just run pd as root, even without the -rt switch.
pix.
On Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:48:34 +0100 Frank Barknecht fbar@footils.org wrote:
Hallo, navz@dreaming.org hat gesagt: // navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
I run 2.6 and "pd -rt" without problems on both my machines, laptop and stationary.
ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
Hallo, Miller Puckette hat gesagt: // Miller Puckette wrote:
Also, it might matter whether or not you're running Jack and/or ALSA...
Yes, I think, this could be more important than tcl/tk, which here currently is tcl/tk8.4, but it was tcl/tk8.3 for a long time.
I normally use the OSS output in Pd, over 2.6's ALSA-emu, but I also tested Jack and alsa-mode. I never had problems with -realtime in the latest version, although I only use it in performance/recording situations.
Ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
Howdy,
navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a kernel config issue.
No problems here. Using ALSA or Jack. Only been on 2.6 for a week tho, so something could come up. With my luck, it would be in the middle of a gig! ;-)
d.
for me it seems that the problem was either with the kernel < 2.6.4 or the fact that i'm using a mac_ppc and had both the AT keyboard kernel option and the mac ADB device support running at the same time... probably the latter i think so im not going to rebuild the kernel in 2.6.3 to test unless someone really wants me to.
btw im using ALSA, haven't got around to learning about JACK yet, but it looks useful... wonder if theres something like that for video ie, can you use multiple applications with the same /dev/??
cheers
nav
Quoting derek holzer derek@x-i.net:
Howdy,
navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a
kernel
config issue.
No problems here. Using ALSA or Jack. Only been on 2.6 for a week tho, so something could come up. With my luck, it would be in the middle of a gig! ;-)
d.
-- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ---Oblique Strategy # 21: "Be less critical"
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scratch my last message about this problem having being solved by a kernel config on 2.6.4
it still happens!! (the keyboard locks up in root/-rt mode)
just not so frequently. i know this isn't so helpful, i'll try and figure out what the stressor is and get back to the list... in the meantime forget i said it was solved.
nav
Quoting derek holzer derek@x-i.net:
Howdy,
navz@dreaming.org wrote:
Has anyone been able to get the 2.6 linux kernel to work with the realtime scheduling? I get a keyboard/kernel crash still, wondering if its a
kernel
config issue.
No problems here. Using ALSA or Jack. Only been on 2.6 for a week tho, so something could come up. With my luck, it would be in the middle of a gig! ;-)
d.
-- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ---Oblique Strategy # 21: "Be less critical"
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g4 ibook 800 kernel 2.6.4 w/ALSA for powermac tcl 8.3.4 (gentoo package) tk 8.3.4-r1 (gentoo package)
sorry for the triple postings &
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hi again,
navz@dreaming.org wrote:
g4 ibook 800 kernel 2.6.4 w/ALSA for powermac tcl 8.3.4 (gentoo package) tk 8.3.4-r1 (gentoo package)
I recall some problems with Linux on PPC. For example, I could never get the line in from the "Screamer" soundcards working, no matter what kernel or ALSA version.
But your thing sounds like it could be an IRQ problem. You might "cat /proc/interrupts" to see where what is going. Also, you might add "pci=noacpi" or even "acpi=off" to your boot arguments in Grub or Lilo, and see of that helps.
good luck, d.
-
derek holzer -
Frank Barknecht -
guenter geiger -
Miller Puckette -
navz＠dreaming.org -
pix -
Tim Blechmann