Hi list,
are there any known issues of loading Gem 0.93-3 via Deken in "Pd version 0.48-0 compiled for Macintosh OSX 10.6 or later" (the non-32-bit non-i386) version? I seems to not work on multiple machines around me.
What are the latest versions of Pd and Gem working together on OS X?
Thank you for your help, which is greatly appreciated. Peter
On 09/28/2017 08:15 PM, Peter P. wrote:
are there any known issues of loading Gem 0.93-3 via Deken in "Pd version 0.48-0 compiled for Macintosh OSX 10.6 or later" (the non-32-bit non-i386) version? I seems to not work on multiple machines around me.
What are the latest versions of Pd and Gem working together on OS X?
Gem binaries for OSX are only available as i386 (32bit). this binary requires a i386 (32bit) Pd. nothing else will work¹
gfmsard IOhannes
¹you can compile Gem yourself for amd64/64bit on OSX, which will work nicely, with all the features stripped that Apple decided to not make available for 64bit - like QuickTime.
2017-09-28 15:20 GMT-03:00 IOhannes m zmölnig zmoelnig@iem.at:
On 09/28/2017 08:15 PM, Peter P. wrote:
are there any known issues of loading Gem 0.93-3 via Deken in "Pd version 0.48-0 compiled for Macintosh OSX 10.6 or later" (the non-32-bit non-i386) version? I seems to not work on multiple machines around me.
What are the latest versions of Pd and Gem working together on OS X?
Gem binaries for OSX are only available as i386 (32bit). this binary requires a i386 (32bit) Pd. nothing else will work¹
gfmsard IOhannes
¹you can compile Gem yourself for amd64/64bit on OSX, which will work nicely, with all the features stripped that Apple decided to not make available for 64bit - like QuickTime.
Hi, I don't get it, sorry, do you mean all Gem features won't work? Like whatever depends on QuickTime? I don't use Gem, but I always here there's this problem with it and I'd like to know better what's up, so I can tell my students.
Further and definitive question is: is there anything one can do to make Gem fully available for 64bits and up in deken? Or is this the end of the road?
cheers
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On 09/29/2017 04:10 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
do you mean all Gem features won't work?
no.
Like whatever depends on QuickTime?
yes of course, since there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit
Further and definitive question is: is there anything one can do to make Gem fully available for 64bits
sure. get money, pay a coder.
gfamdsr IOhannes
hello, I don't use OSX, but having Gem not being cross platform is a problem. so I think "get money, pay a coder." should be considered.
Since we are many being upset by the current Gem situation, I hope that a subscription should gather a decent amount of money.
Dan, Antoine, or anyone else : How long do you think it would need to get pix_video, pix_film (and all other object that are currently not working on osX), and to get a Gem binary for osX 32 and 64 bits? and how much money would you need to add this work on your TODO list?
cheers Cyrille
Le 29/09/2017 à 08:34, IOhannes m zmölnig a écrit :
On 09/29/2017 04:10 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
do you mean all Gem features won't work?
no.
Like whatever depends on QuickTime?
yes of course, since there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit
Further and definitive question is: is there anything one can do to make Gem fully available for 64bits
sure. get money, pay a coder.
gfamdsr IOhannes
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Hi,
afair Dan started an AVFoundation plugin a while ago, but it was only for movie decoding. and as I noted on the Github issue tracker, for video grabbing (aka pix_video) libuvc could be a good challenger. At least libuvc is the only library I know on OSX with which you have almost full control over camera parameter (like the so common "auto exposition" which sucks when doing video processing). Some are using it just to control camera parameter in parallel with AVFoundation for frame grabbing but this doesn't make much sense to me since if the camera is available though libuvc then it's easier to grab frame with libuvc directly. One caveat is that libuvc works only with USB Video Compliant device which tends to be common nowadays, but not all video devices are supported. An AVFoundation based plugin for video grabbing could also be done with limited camera control. And I don't know if Apple planned support for more camera feature soon. Moreover libuvc is cross-platform, so a video_uvc plugin will work on all platforms (though it's already supported on Linux through libv4l2).
I think I can do something for 2k€ by the end of the year (lots of things on my TODO list right now) at least the libuvc version.
And since you're talking about cross-platform Gem, don't forget a lot of people are still using Windows. Having Gem working on OSX and Linux won't make them switch their OS I think (even if it was my first reason to say goob bye to Windows a while ago :-) ) so having Gem on Windows will be great.
Also I do think that it will be nice to have a working package distributed via Deken, even if I know Iohannes doesn't like it so much because of the platform specificities. It will be much easier for people to use it if it works well out-of-the-box at least on mainstream distribution (Windows / Macos / Debian). We could use online continuous integration service (aka travis and appveyor) to help us on that.
Hope that's clear enough.
Best
Antoine
-- do it yourself http://antoine.villeret.free.fr
2017-09-29 11:52 GMT+02:00 cyrille henry ch@chnry.net:
hello, I don't use OSX, but having Gem not being cross platform is a problem. so I think "get money, pay a coder." should be considered.
Since we are many being upset by the current Gem situation, I hope that a subscription should gather a decent amount of money.
Dan, Antoine, or anyone else : How long do you think it would need to get pix_video, pix_film (and all other object that are currently not working on osX), and to get a Gem binary for osX 32 and 64 bits? and how much money would you need to add this work on your TODO list?
cheers Cyrille
Le 29/09/2017 à 08:34, IOhannes m zmölnig a écrit :
On 09/29/2017 04:10 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
do you mean all Gem features won't work?
no.
Like whatever depends on QuickTime?
yes of course, since there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit
Further and definitive question is: is there anything one can do to make Gem fully available for 64bits
sure. get money, pay a coder.
gfamdsr IOhannes
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.puredata.info/li stinfo/pd-list
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.puredata.info/li stinfo/pd-list
2017-09-29 3:34 GMT-03:00 IOhannes m zmölnig zmoelnig@iem.at:
On 09/29/2017 04:10 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
do you mean all Gem features won't work?
oops, meant to ask do you mean all Gem features *WILL* work?
sorry
there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit
Can anyone please elaborate on this please? This sounds weird to me, cause the 32 binary of Gem will run on 32 bit Pd on OSX/64bit, so "there is" QuickTime on OSX/64bit. Does it mean it has to be run on 32bit applications?
And then, if you say there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit, it sounds like there is nothing one can do to make it happen, unless rebuild OSX/64bit in a way it has QuickTime (and only Apple could do that).
So I'm really confused on what the technical issues are.
Thanks
On Fre, 2017-09-29 at 17:04 -0300, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
2017-09-29 3:34 GMT-03:00 IOhannes m zmölnig zmoelnig@iem.at:
On 09/29/2017 04:10 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
do you mean all Gem features won't work?
oops, meant to ask do you mean all Gem features WILL work?
sorry
there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit
Can anyone please elaborate on this please? This sounds weird to me, cause the 32 binary of Gem will run on 32 bit Pd on OSX/64bit, so "there is" QuickTime on OSX/64bit. Does it mean it has to be run on 32bit applications?
And then, if you say there is no QuickTime on OSX/64bit, it sounds like there is nothing one can do to make it happen, unless rebuild OSX/64bit in a way it has QuickTime (and only Apple could do that).
So I'm really confused on what the technical issues are.
Let me chime in to save others (most of all: the devs) the time to answer here. I'm not very knowledgeable on the matter, but I believe everything has been said already. The Quicktime framework called QTKit exists only as 32-bit version and has been deprecated. Since Mac OS X Lion the new default media framework is AVFoundation [1] which is 64- bit, which is the 'primary' arch on OS X / macOS. From what I understand, Gem only has plugins for QTKit, but not yet for AVFoundation (we read recently that Dan has been working on video playback with AVFoundation, though). This means if you want to have video playback and recording in Gem now, you are bound to 32-bit Gem, which means you need a 32-bit Pd and all other externals you want to use have to be 32-bit, too. At some point, Apple will stop including old QTKit in their newer OS versions and Gem will lose most (any?) ability to access/write media (camera, video files, etc.).
It takes some work to make Gem support the newer AVFoundation framework, but this step is necessary for 64-bit / future-proof Gem to become a reality.
Please correct me if I spread alternative facts.
Roman
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Alexandre Torres Porres -
Antoine Villeret -
cyrille henry -
IOhannes m zmölnig -
Peter P. -
Roman Haefeli