Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
hi
On 7/17/06, Chuckk Hubbard badmuthahubbard@gmail.com wrote:
I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge.
i think the best reason to go to music grad school is to teach at a university. if you want to be a computer musician and are not particularly interested in teaching, you're going to need to figure that out how to make a living yourself. and the debt you'd take on in grad school is probably going to put you behind instead of ahead.
there's the 'day job' route. for instance, you could also learn to be a programmer, but that will take up a lot of the energy you'd probably rather put into music. but the programming should also fertilize your computer music.
also, don't underestimate your ability to teach yourself stuff. computer music is all new, and if you get very far with it, you will need to have the skills to teach yourself stuff that you're interested in. this is pretty important for all creative people in most disciplines.
and as an artist, you need to find your own way anyway. so the sooner you get started on that [difficult] road, the better.
good luck!
Hi Chuck -
You should check out the CCRMA program at Stanford. I was a graduate student in computer science student, but I spent a lot of time with the CCRMA community, and I took much of the coursework that a masters student in their 1-year "Music, Science, and Technology" would take. MST students are formally in the music department, but get a good dose of synthesis techniques, algorithmic composition, and signal processing - along with elective options where they can explore controller-building and human-computer interaction, perceptual audio coding, acoustics, and other topics. I think there's a course on music cognition, and the symbolic systems program also at Stanford features some connections between music and psychology/perception.
here is the description of the 1-year masters program at CCRMA: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/mst-info.html
I think that you could connect these technical topics very tightly to musical studies, and the degree to which that's done varies from student to student, based on interest. One year feels like a short amount of time to absorb all of this technique and do creative work with it (this observation is based on conversations with students in the program), but Stanford is on the quarter system - so you get three rounds of courses rather than 2 that you'd have with semesters.. The facilities are good, some of the pioneers of computer music/sound are there (and others come through to visit fairly regularly), and the community is dynamic and stimulating. Let me know if you want any other info - and there are undoubtedly other CCRMA students/grads on this list, since PD is a tool of choice in the music controllers class. http://ccrma.stanford.edu/courses/250a/
cheers, -David Merrill
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
Hi Chuck and David
you're right at least one of us is on the list ;) I just graduated a month ago from the MA/MST program at CCRMA - I'd be happy to discuss one on one with ya
I know another person from my class is very active on the linux lists - Kjetil - he probably sees this too
And yeah, PD is pretty important in the program - not just for 250 (HCI) but also for the 220 series which is key in the program
-- Aaron
On Mon, 2006-07-17 at 17:37 -0400, David Merrill wrote:
Hi Chuck -
You should check out the CCRMA program at Stanford. I was a graduate student in computer science student, but I spent a lot of time with the CCRMA community, and I took much of the coursework that a masters student in their 1-year "Music, Science, and Technology" would take. MST students are formally in the music department, but get a good dose of synthesis techniques, algorithmic composition, and signal processing - along with elective options where they can explore controller-building and human-computer interaction, perceptual audio coding, acoustics, and other topics. I think there's a course on music cognition, and the symbolic systems program also at Stanford features some connections between music and psychology/perception.
here is the description of the 1-year masters program at CCRMA: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/mst-info.html
I think that you could connect these technical topics very tightly to musical studies, and the degree to which that's done varies from student to student, based on interest. One year feels like a short amount of time to absorb all of this technique and do creative work with it (this observation is based on conversations with students in the program), but Stanford is on the quarter system - so you get three rounds of courses rather than 2 that you'd have with semesters.. The facilities are good, some of the pioneers of computer music/sound are there (and others come through to visit fairly regularly), and the community is dynamic and stimulating. Let me know if you want any other info - and there are undoubtedly other CCRMA students/grads on this list, since PD is a tool of choice in the music controllers class. http://ccrma.stanford.edu/courses/250a/
cheers, -David Merrill
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
Aaron J. Trumm wrote:
And yeah, PD is pretty important in the program - not just for 250 (HCI) but also for the 220 series which is key in the program
aah, that's right.. I spent so much time programming Common Lisp Music that those experiences crowded out the PD-related memories from 220... ;) cheers, -David
On 7/17/06, David Merrill dmerrill@media.mit.edu wrote:
here is the description of the 1-year masters program at CCRMA: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/mst-info.html
Alas, "The program is designed for candidates having an undergraduate engineering or science degree or a degree that includes course work in engineering mathematics."
p.s. a follow-up on my recent reply - you can also do a PhD at CCRMA, if you want to go deeper and have more time to spend... http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/phd-info.html
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
Hi all,
I teach at one of these, so I won't presume to give an unbiased comparison, but the Really Good Places that do both music and computer music research would include:
UCSD, UCB, UCSC, McGill, MIT Media Lab, Stanford, Princeton, NYU, Columbia, Carnegie-Mellon and, as of lately, Harvard.
My apologies to any I've left out unjustly; lists like this are never complete.
cheers Miller
On Mon, Jul 17, 2006 at 05:48:15PM -0400, David Merrill wrote:
p.s. a follow-up on my recent reply - you can also do a PhD at CCRMA, if you want to go deeper and have more time to spend... http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/phd-info.html
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
-- MIT Media Lab dmerrill@media.mit.edu
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot. -Chuckk
On 7/17/06, Miller Puckette mpuckett@imusic1.ucsd.edu wrote:
Hi all,
I teach at one of these, so I won't presume to give an unbiased comparison, but the Really Good Places that do both music and computer music research would include:
UCSD, UCB, UCSC, McGill, MIT Media Lab, Stanford, Princeton, NYU, Columbia, Carnegie-Mellon and, as of lately, Harvard.
My apologies to any I've left out unjustly; lists like this are never complete.
cheers Miller
On Mon, Jul 17, 2006 at 05:48:15PM -0400, David Merrill wrote:
p.s. a follow-up on my recent reply - you can also do a PhD at CCRMA, if you want to go deeper and have more time to spend... http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/phd-info.html
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
-- MIT Media Lab dmerrill@media.mit.edu
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Hallo!
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
If you don't want to pay that much for a school and also want to learn a new language then there a many institutes in europe ...
LG Georg
On 7/19/06, Georg Holzmann grhPD@gmx.at wrote:
Hallo!
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
If you don't want to pay that much for a school and also want to learn a new language then there a many institutes in europe ...
Hi, Georg. My current girlfriend is from Romania, and she has said the same thing. If you know any good schools for computer music, let me know. -Chuckk
Hallo!
Hi, Georg. My current girlfriend is from Romania, and she has said the same thing. If you know any good schools for computer music, let me know.
I can only speak for the place where I am now. Here at the IEM in Graz is e.g. a Composition-COmputermusic Master Study at the University of Art and the Univ. of Technology ...
There are of course many more, e.g.: Barcelona (Music Technology Group), Vienna, some in Italy, Schweiz, the Netherland, France, UK, ... (maybe some people from there, which are on this list, can give more info ...)
LG Georg
I would totally vouch for this. Living abroad is a must for anybody. Education outside of "education" is almost as important as the school itself.
David
On 19/07/06, Georg Holzmann grhPD@gmx.at wrote:
Hallo!
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
If you don't want to pay that much for a school and also want to learn a new language then there a many institutes in europe ...
LG Georg
See, I thought that coming to Philly even, and there's still great stuff I haven't seen or done in 3 years. For months at a time I don't leave about a 5-block radius. I know, Philly is not Stockholm or Glasgow or Prague, but it's far more interesting than where I came from. The one Bible passage I put some credence in says something about he who uses what he has well will be given more. -Chuckk
On 7/20/06, David NG McCallum d@mentalfloss.ca wrote:
I would totally vouch for this. Living abroad is a must for anybody. Education outside of "education" is almost as important as the school itself.
David
On 19/07/06, Georg Holzmann grhPD@gmx.at wrote:
Hallo!
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
If you don't want to pay that much for a school and also want to learn a new language then there a many institutes in europe ...
LG Georg
-- __ _ _ _ __ _ http://sintheta.org
I am curious about this. About how much would it cost to do one of these programs? I am working at a US corporation for a few years to gather funds and control my debt, but am interested in traveling abroad (especially to either Austria, Germany, or Argentina).
I was going to save up for a strictly nonacademic traveling experience, but if a university in one of these countries (_especially_ IEM) would be at a lower cost than NYU or CM, I would definitely consider it. How does it compare? I know that EU schools are often subsidized by their host countries, and I always assumed that there would be penalties for an American abroad.
~Kyle
On 7/19/06, Georg Holzmann grhPD@gmx.at wrote:
Hallo!
Thanks, this is exactly the kind of list I wanted. I may not be able to get into or pay for any of these schools, but I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
If you don't want to pay that much for a school and also want to learn a new language then there a many institutes in europe ...
LG Georg
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Hi again. I'm making my way through this list. I see some schools that seem to be geared more towards engineering and programming than music, to the point of requiring experience or degrees in them. I am very interested in those things, and I have an aptitude for them, but I'm wondering how open they are to people with undergrad degrees in music. Ironically, I'm disappointed with how the music education system works (like how it teaches without an understanding of its own subject), and I'm not very interested in pursuing a master's in composition. Is it likely I'll be prepared for one of these programs with an undergrad in music?
My other concern is paying for school in California, but I take it I'm on my own for that.
Thanks. -Chuckk
On 7/17/06, Miller Puckette mpuckett@imusic1.ucsd.edu wrote:
Hi all,
I teach at one of these, so I won't presume to give an unbiased comparison, but the Really Good Places that do both music and computer music research would include:
UCSD, UCB, UCSC, McGill, MIT Media Lab, Stanford, Princeton, NYU, Columbia, Carnegie-Mellon and, as of lately, Harvard.
My apologies to any I've left out unjustly; lists like this are never complete.
cheers Miller
On Mon, Jul 17, 2006 at 05:48:15PM -0400, David Merrill wrote:
p.s. a follow-up on my recent reply - you can also do a PhD at CCRMA, if you want to go deeper and have more time to spend... http://ccrma.stanford.edu/info/phd-info.html
Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
Hi. I am entering senior year as a composition major, at Univ Arts in Philly. I'm interested in going to grad school for computer music, and I want a little more of a challenge. I like freedom to pursue lots of things, but at my current school that has meant pursuing things the faculty can't really help me with. Ideally, I want a good mix of computer and musical studies. I am interested in learning all I can about computers, but I don't want to abandon "traditional" things like melody and themes. I've tried to learn C in the past, but I can't justify spending lots of time on it while studying here. It's mostly live performances, and mostly jazz, here.
I've checked out some stuff about UCSD, and their including of music cognition as an actual field of study is great, it's my other favorite subject. Not so big on algorithmic composition, but I'd be curious. Does anyone have any recommendations for other places I should check out? I'm willing to relocate, considering I would probably have to.
Thanks. -Chuckk
-- MIT Media Lab dmerrill@media.mit.edu
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
On Sun, 10 Sep 2006, Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
I'm making my way through this list. I see some schools that seem to be geared more towards engineering and programming than music, to the point of requiring experience or degrees in them.
Oh my. I would be ruled out of those, as my only degree is in neither programming nor engineering.
What kind of experience do they want? Are there special rules for excluding certain types of experience at the benefit of academic and/or corporate experience? Is experience anything I could lie about, if I happen to know what I'm talking about? Those would be my concerns... (well, that, and money, of course...)
Ironically, I'm disappointed with how the music education system works (like how it teaches without an understanding of its own subject),
Can't this be also said of most Humanities? (ducking and running...)
_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801 - http://artengine.ca/matju | Freelance Digital Arts Engineer, Montréal QC Canada
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\js -
Aaron J. Trumm -
Chuckk Hubbard -
David Merrill -
David NG McCallum -
Georg Holzmann -
Kyle Klipowicz -
Mathieu Bouchard -
Miller Puckette