Pd-list March 2010

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152 participants
270 discussions

Re: [PD] PD and Midi Time Code
by András Murányi 24 Mar '10

24 Mar '10

> >> On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Martin Dupras <martindupras(a)gmail.com>wrote: >> >>> Has anyone successfully received MTC from another application on OS X? >>> >>> I'm trying to send MTC from Logic Pro 9 into PD. I receive numbers, but >>> the data seems to be arriving faster than the queue can spit it out. If I >>> press 'play' in logic even for just a few seconds, the numbers keep coming >>> into pd for quite a while. >>> >>> Any advice? >>> >>> >> Hello Martin, >> >> Logic has a feature called Continuous MTC that may be related to this. >> Also, I remember that it is not advised to configure MTC to be sent at every >> quarter frame as it may jam MIDI communication. So first you may want to >> check if your outgoing MTC is alrite. >> >> Andras >> >> >> 2010/3/23 Martin Dupras <martindupras(a)gmail.com> > Hi Andras, > > Thanks for the advice. > > I'm looking at the Logic manual and I can't find anywhere where one > configures MTC to not be send every quarter frame. Any idea where I should > look? > > Many thanks! > > - martin > Hello Martin, i'm copying this back to the list... It seems that Logic cannot itself control the flow of MTC in any more detail. Upon further inspection, i also start to doubt that there is any way or need do that... because every bit of the MTC, including the quarter frames, are necessary at the end. This is the best explanation of MTC i've seen so far: http://web.archive.org/web/20080322040604/www.borg.com/~jglatt/tech/mtc.htm (Btw the whole web-site *was* nice and the Technical Docs section is excellent. http://web.archive.org/web/20080626112116/http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/ ) So what i think you can do to reduce MTC traffic is that you reduce the Frame Rate. Andras

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Pd, Max/Msp, Reaktor, Plogue Bidule... How do these compare?
by Jeffrey Concepcion 23 Mar '10

23 Mar '10

>From an audio processing perspective... My first introduction to a visual programming environment was Reaktor, then Max, then Pd. Only recently did i find out about plogue bidule. As far as interface goes they seem quite similar, and one obviously must consider that the commercial products have customer support rather than the community effort that is PD (which is great, don't get me wrong) and the "user friendliness" approach they must have in order to appeal to users. As far as i know, reaktor and plogue bidule have VST capabilities, i believe the last i read about the [vst] object in Pd was that is was generally defective (can anyone confirm or correct this?). Max seems to be the largest and most complex of all (The creators of the Monome <http://monome.org/> and OHM64 <http://www.lividinstruments.com/hardware_ohm64.php> both designed their product with max, although i'm sure it could have been with Pd just the same). correct me if i'm wrong, but i understand that pd and max are the most powerful, although i've yet to build anything that sounds as good as what i was able to make in reaktor, and i have no idea about the sound quality that can be achieved with plogue bidule. your thoughts? jeff -- www.avmachinists.org Puerto Rico based Art Collective/ Non-Profit Org

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PD and Midi Time Code
by Martin Dupras 23 Mar '10

23 Mar '10

Has anyone successfully received MTC from another application on OS X? I'm trying to send MTC from Logic Pro 9 into PD. I receive numbers, but the data seems to be arriving faster than the queue can spit it out. If I press 'play' in logic even for just a few seconds, the numbers keep coming into pd for quite a while. Any advice? Cheers, - martin

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Mac OS X/PowerPC builds have returned
by Hans-Christoph Steiner 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

We have Mac OS X/PowerPC builds again: http://autobuild.puredata.info/auto-build/latest/ They might be a bit spotty until the machine gets back into its permanent home. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - General Smedley Butler

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Re: [PD] avoiding flicker with pix_video+pix_movement
by Matteo Sisti Sette 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

IOHannes wrote: > > Hi, > > > > How do you work this around? How can one "know" whether a new > > frame has been captured or not? > you can learn quite everything about a pix with [pix_info] How can I use it to learn whether a new frame has been captured? I tried [print]ing the output from the 7th outlet, whose function is not quite clear in the help patch: "list <newimage> <newfilm>". I guessed either <newimage> or <newfilm> _may_ be a boolean meaning whether the image is new (or the film, whatever it is), but even if I set the gemwin at 30 or 50 fps, I _always_ get "1 0", and I don't think my webcam captures 50 fps....... thanks m. -- Matteo Sisti Sette matteosistisette(a)gmail.com http://www.matteosistisette.com

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Re: [PD] Pd, Max/Msp, Reaktor, Plogue Bidule... How do these, compare?
by Matteo Sisti Sette 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

Marco Donnarumma <devel(a)thesaddj.com> wrote: > I personally think there is nothing to >compare. All of them are quite > separate environments, and i mean not only >computing capabilities, > flexibility and GUI, but above all each community >supporting the > projects. Well I think Max and PD _are_ quite comparable; their domains do overlap quite a lot, though of course they are not identical. And though it is absurd to state that one is plainly better than the other, it _is_ reasonable to discuss in which aspects one is better and in which others the other is. Especially for the sake of improving PD until it _is_ just plainly better :)) Then the answer to the original question (i.e. the subject) is: Pd rules, all the others just suck - just kidding here. By the way I once collaborated with a guy who composes electroacustic music and now is doing a Ph.D. at Harvard University (I made some Pd patches for a piece he wrote), and he was fond of Pd, preferring it over Max mainly because it is Open Source etc. So when he went to Harvard and everybody there uses Max, he still was willing to keep using Pd and keep learning Pd. At the end, he told me he decided to give up and start using Max; and not because everybody does (this guy generally is not scared of being on his own) but because of documentation. He said: with Max you just download tutorials, manuals and the like and you just have to study and you learn; with Pd it is not so. He often felt stuck and/or frustrated. I don't think Max is easier to learn than Pd; i really think they are equally difficult (or equally easy) to learn (though this is more a guess than an opinion, since I don't know Max enough). But this doesn't seem to be a unique case: I heard quite a lot of people saying they find it easier to learn Max. So I think it is a matter of documentation. Though it may be as well a matter of personal "taste" (just the "look and feel" of an application may make you feel more or less confortable). -- Matteo Sisti Sette matteosistisette(a)gmail.com http://www.matteosistisette.com

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Path limit on Linux?
by Ignacio Lois 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

Hello everyone, I'm running pd on Ubuntu here, and it looks like there's a limit of ten different paths on the path menu. Is this true? How can I get more than these? Also, is it possible to export the path list somehow? Thanks!

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avoiding flicker with pix_video+pix_movement
by Matteo Sisti Sette 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

Hi, I've found a thread about this issue in the archives but no solution. When you use [pix_video] followed by [pix_movement], you get either a white frame or a black frame every once in a while. In Windows I see black-frame flickering, while in Mac I have seesn "frame-identity" flickering. By "frame-identity flickering" I mean that pix_movement outputs an image equal to the input frame, as if the frame was compared with a black previous frame. I guess the reason of the flickering is that the camera may generate frames slowlier than Gem renders, that is, in the time between one frame rendering and the next one, the camera may not have produced a new frame. My guess is that that in Mac, when this happens, the "missing" frame is seen as a black frame, so pix_movement produces a difference equal to the input frame. This is clearly a bug. Pretty strange since it seems to affect only pix_movement (by directly using pix_video as a texture you don't get any black frames).... In Windows on the other hands, it seems that when the camera has not had the time to produce a new frame, a frame identical to the last one is seen, which produces a null difference in pix_movement. While this last case is probably the expected behaviour, it makes the combination [pix_video]+[pix_movement] totally useless to do motion detection. How do you work this around? How can one "know" whether a new frame has been captured or not? Without this information you can't do any useful motion detection: you never know whether you are comparing two actually identical frames or the same frame....... Any idea? An obvious workaround is to lower gem's framerate but this is obviously unacceptable in most situations... thanks in advance m. -- Matteo Sisti Sette matteosistisette(a)gmail.com http://www.matteosistisette.com

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Re: [PD] Using Pd to play drums in a band
by Austin Huang 22 Mar '10

22 Mar '10

I once constructed a live setup in keykit to make laptop music on the fly with a live band. It's not easy to do well (you really come to respect how difficult it is to replicate the expressiveness of a traditional instrument). taptempo will work in a live setting, but there are a few tricks that help make it useable: - You may want to compensate for latency (so that the computer doesn't come in on beat 1 +20ms or whatever your latency is). i.e. the phase for the beginning of the measure is shifted back by -Xms to compensate for latency - I rigged it so that when you tap N beats (where N is the number of taps used compute the average bpm), the taptempo would automatically trigger some sort of sequencer module on the N+1 beat. Every instant is critical in a live performance context... - Speaking of doing things efficiently, I preferred to have the taptempo take 8th notes instead of quarter notes. This made it easier to come in within a shorter amount of time (but still have a few taps to compute an average bpm). ~A On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Austin Huang <austinh(a)cs.brown.edu> wrote: > I once constructed a live setup in keykit to make laptop music on the fly > with a live band. It's not easy to do well (you really come to respect how > difficult it is to replicate the expressiveness of a traditional > instrument). taptempo will work in a live setting, but there are a few > tricks that help make it useable: > > - You may want to compensate for latency (so that the computer doesn't come > in on beat 1 +20ms or whatever your latency is). i.e. the phase for the > beginning of the measure is shifted back by -Xms to compensate for latency > > - I rigged it so that when you tap N beats (where N is the number of taps > used compute the average bpm), the taptempo would automatically trigger some > sort of sequencer module on the N+1 beat. Every instant is critical in a > live performance context... > > - Speaking of doing things efficiently, I preferred to have the taptempo > take 8th notes instead of quarter notes. This made it easier to come in > within a shorter amount of time (but still have a few taps to compute an > average bpm). > > ~A > > On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 2:33 PM, Dan Wilcox <danomatika(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> I have some some drum sample, step sequencers, and pattern saving patches >> if you want. >> >> Check out : http://danomatika.com/software/rc-patches/ >> >> On Mar 14, 2010, at 11:13 PM, Andrew Faraday wrote: >> >> Have you had any luck in building a step sequencer, by the way? >> >> > From: mr.spoon21(a)gmail.com >> > Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 14:26:47 +0100 >> > To: james(a)4thharmonic.com >> > CC: pd-list(a)iem.at >> > Subject: Re: [PD] Using Pd to play drums in a band >> > >> > On 14 March 2010 13:42, James Dunn <james(a)4thharmonic.com> wrote: >> > > Quoth Carlo Trimarchi, on 14/03/10 11:30: >> > > >> > > Not sure if this is the best way but it might help you. It uses >> [demux] from >> > > the zexy library. Hit the spacebar to tap out a tempo. >> > >> > Thanks for your interest (and also thanks to Andrew Faraday who >> > replied directly to me), but I think these tapping methods are hardly >> > working fine for me. Maybe it's me - I'm unable to tap at the same >> > time - but every tap it displays a different number. I have to think >> > something else, maybe. >> > >> > Anyway, I'd like some starting point to implement a drum machine or a >> > step sequencer. Maybe some existing patch or some particularly useful >> > tutorial or argument. >> > >> > Thanks again, >> > Carlo >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Pd-list(a)iem.at mailing list >> > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> ------------------------------ >> Not got a Hotmail account? Sign-up now - Free<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/197222280/direct/01/> >> >> >> -------- >> Dan Wilcox >> danomatika.com >> robotcowboy.com >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list(a)iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >

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Re: [PD] mic preamp: hardware or inside Pd?
by Roberto Duarte 21 Mar '10

21 Mar '10

Thanks Pierre, what i want to do is to get some noises through these coil mics and amplify some objects with piezo mics, no recording here, I mean will be also real time processing, just for jamming and get used to Pd. Eventually I will want to plug in a lap steel guitar or a 3 bridges guitar, it depend on if I can, finally manage to build one... Could be nice a warm tube preamp sound, but for this, is not really needed. Best Roberto El 21/03/2010, a las 13:29, Pierre Massat escribió: > Hi Roberto, > > I don't know much about what you're asking, but i do know that building audio hardware isn't easy at all, and probably eventually just as expensive as industrial products. > Now concerning the question of whether you should amplify the signal within Pd or not, i'd say it all depends on your needs. If you want to record a singer or an instrument it's always good to have an analog pre-amp before you feed the signal into Pd. If you need it for something else it may not be necessary. > I personnaly use Pd to process the sound of my electric guitar in real-time. For this i use a usb interface (EMU 0404), and the Pd-processed sound ends up in my tube amp. > Anyway, it is very much a matter of taste here, i mean if you like the sound of your mics without a pre-amp it's fine. Amplifying the sound in Pd will not change the sound, whereas amplifying it first with a pre-amp will change it (depending on whether it has tubes, and on the general quality of the product). You just have to choose what you like most. > > Pierre > > 2010/3/21 Roberto Duarte <roberto.duarte(a)gmail.com> > Hello all, > maybe somebody could bring me some lights about this: > > I want to jam with some piezos and coil mics, I could get a cheap M-Audio Quattro or similar (no pre amp included) and all this into Pd for some processing. > > What would be better: > 1. to get or build some hardware preamps or > 2. to amplify the signal inside Pd? > > Another way to go could be, instead of buying a dedicated Audio Interface, build one on an Arduino board or on this new CUI32 USB board, using those (several) analog inputs. For me, in a way could be good also, because of learning how to do it. > > I will appreciate any help or tip on this.. > > Roberto > > > Roberto Duarte > +49 30 639 16015 > +49 176 967 64274 > Treptowerstr. 21, HH 4 Stock > 12059 Berlin > www.robertoduarte.de > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list(a)iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > Roberto Duarte +49 30 639 16015 +49 176 967 64274 Treptowerstr. 21, HH 4 Stock 12059 Berlin www.robertoduarte.de

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Pd-list March 2010