Pd-list January 2008

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133 participants
232 discussions

tabread4~~
by Ypatios Grigoriadis 05 Jan '08

05 Jan '08

Hello everyone! I work with pd for about 3 years. Right from the beginning (or almost..) i ran into the following problem: table look up with [tabread4~] is great for small array but, due to 32bit floating resolution, if the array is of a certain length and longer, look up can not be so exact. The result is distortion. I am not a programmer so i could not find the solution myself. I wrote then to the list and i got feedback for the problem but only info. No practical solution. Thanks to IOhannes there is a new object that takes 2 signals to specify the position for the look up which makes it way more precise (this idea came originally from my professor Gerhard Eckel). [tabread4~~] which you can find in the latest zexy lib. I tested the object but not in many ways yet.... it seems to be stable though. I am also making a small -help patch for the object which i will soon post (if it's ok with IOhannes..) So thank you IOhannes for your time and effort! I am really grateful. (Sorry if i was too greedy the other day about the [vline~~]... but it's all for the Art!!!) -- YpatIOs. ... :-)

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appropriate category for typos in documentation
by Libero Mureddu 05 Jan '08

05 Jan '08

Hi, I think I found a typo in the B03.tabread4~.pd patch in the audio examples section. At the end of the first comment it should be written "... for a 131-point table such we have here, it's 1 to 129 (so the "good" segment is 129 samples long)." I read in http://pure-data.sourceforge.net/old/trackers.php that if I want to submit it I have to choose the right subproject. Which is the right one to choose for a typo in the documentation? Ciao LIbero -- Libero Mureddu http://webusers.siba.fi/~limuredd/ http://www.myspace.com/liberomureddu

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Re: [PD] MIDI on Win XP
by Ingo Scherzinger 05 Jan '08

05 Jan '08

> > with Pd (Win XP) but I'm running into problems. When I move a knob > > on the midi controller there is a delay of at least one second until > > the controller data show up in the Pd window (I simply output > > controllers using the [ctlin] object). This delay makes it pretty > > much unusable. This happenes if the audio latency of pd is set lower than the latency of your souncard itself. Try installing the asio4all drivers from http://www.asio4all.com/ and set the latency of the asio4all drivers (or any other dedicated asio driver - if your souncard has one) equal or lower to pd's latency. Don't forget to save the setting in the "file/startup" as usual. Hope this helps! Ingo Scherzinger

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Mac OSX internal MIDI?
by Libero Mureddu 04 Jan '08

04 Jan '08

Hi, in order to use the DSL synth you have to install SimpleSynth software: http://pete.yandell.com/software/simplesynth/Read%20Me.html then, from the /Applications/Utilities/Audio MIDI Setup Application, choose MIDI Devices tab, and make sure that the IAC Driver is online. Start SimpleSynth and choose as MIDI Source "IAC Driver Bus 1"; start Pd and go to the Preferences->MIDI Settings menu. Here choose as output device IAC Driver: Bus 1, press Apply and OK. Now you should be able to play the Mac internal synth from Pd. Hope this helps, Libero > Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 11:26:21 -0800 > From: Dudley Brooks <dbrooks(a)runforyourlife.org> > Subject: [PD] Mac OSX internal MIDI? > To: pd-list(a)iem.at > Message-ID: <477E885D.4060801(a)runforyourlife.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Mac (and PD) newbie question: > > I have PD on a Macbook Pro with MacOSX 10.4. I have no external MIDI > equipment and no software synth (not yet, anyway). Another application, > Sibelius, shows a playback device called DLS Music Device with the > General MIDI sound set. I was informed by the Sibelius list that DLS is > an internal Mac playback device (possibly the Quicktime synth, or is > that yet another playback device?), but that it is only appears in other > applications if they have explicitly built in support for it. > > Can I get PD to recognize it? If so, how? If not, what are my other > options? Thanks. -- Libero Mureddu http://webusers.siba.fi/~limuredd/ http://www.myspace.com/liberomureddu

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Mac OSX internal MIDI?
by Dudley Brooks 04 Jan '08

04 Jan '08

Mac (and PD) newbie question: I have PD on a Macbook Pro with MacOSX 10.4. I have no external MIDI equipment and no software synth (not yet, anyway). Another application, Sibelius, shows a playback device called DLS Music Device with the General MIDI sound set. I was informed by the Sibelius list that DLS is an internal Mac playback device (possibly the Quicktime synth, or is that yet another playback device?), but that it is only appears in other applications if they have explicitly built in support for it. Can I get PD to recognize it? If so, how? If not, what are my other options? Thanks.

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SQLdb Version 0.01
by Mike McGonagle 04 Jan '08

04 Jan '08

Hello all, I just wanted to let you know that I posted a new version with some fixes. It will also return a <NIL> symbol for any data element that is UNASSIGNED (or a NULL value). (A null is different from 0 or an empty string). There is also an example program called "ReichTest.pd" that shows a simple example of using a Database to store and load some patch data. I have tested this with both Vanilla PD and and some of the Nightly Builds for Extended. Any feedback would be useful. Thanks, Mike

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Re: [PD] SQLdb for linux
by Mike McGonagle 04 Jan '08

04 Jan '08

On Jan 4, 2008 1:31 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner <hans(a)eds.org> wrote: > > I just had a look at ftm.sqlite.help.pd. They use a custom and very > specialized message box to deal with the comma issue. I think your > technique of handling the commas is much more natural to deal with, and > probably more flexible. > Well, I will say that I like the fact of using the COLD inlet for the SQL, it removes all the "wrapping" keywords, as you said. I also think that it will make for the Programmatic generation of SQL much easier. One thing I was playing with, I kind of discovered that it would be best to encourage everyone using dynamic generation to do the whole thing into a single message box that is then passed to the Query object in one fell swoop. The mechanics of trying to stuff SQL into the Query object in smaller chunks might get a little confusing. At least with the use of a single message box, you can see the whole of the SQL statement before it gets sent. > > The part that I still can't see a clear way to deal with is handling the > queries and the results. I had one thought inspired by your send/receive > symbols. Perhaps the first argument to the [sql_query] object would be like > your send/receive symbol, except that it would be the selector in all of the > results returned from that query. Then there could be one database object > that outputs the query data thru an outlet, and the results would still be > sortable using [route]. > I have created an example. I also made some changes to the Database object to allow it to recognize a NULL value from the database. NULL's I think will be one datatype that is kind of difficult to deal with, as a Float object can only be returned as a NULL as in the following: select max(id) from table; AND, there is no data in 'table'. This will return a NULL value, and NOT 0. I also think that it should be left to the person designing the database and the PD stuff using a Database object to worry about the differences. The reason behind that is that a User will understand the schema of their database, and should program accordingly. I am going to post this up on the Pure Data site, as I still have yet to figure out the CVS stuff. I will do that this afternoon. Mike > > .hc > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > .hc > > > > On Thu, 3 Jan 2008, Mike McGonagle wrote: > > > > > So, it would appear that I am wrong, it is for PD, but in the README, > > it > > > says it is not working... > > > > > http://ftm.cvs.sourceforge.net/ftm/ftm-sql/pd/README.txt?revision=1.1&view=… > > > > > > It also goes through another Database Layer, rather than compiling > > directly > > > into the external. I still can't figure out its API in PD... > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > PS, sorry for all these messages... > > > > > > On Jan 3, 2008 1:40 PM, Mike McGonagle < mjmogo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > >> http://puredata.info/community/projects/software/ftm/ > > >> Hans, > > >> > > >> This is the URL for the FTM stuff on the PureData site. It appears > > that > > >> this code is still Max specific, and there are a lot of Macros so I > > can't > > >> really tell what is going on at first glance. > > >> > > >> I don't have Max, so if you know anyone that might be using this, and > > they > > >> could send some screen shots of what they have, that would be really > > useful. > > >> IOhannes says he doesn't have Max either, so I don't know anyone who > > might > > >> have access to these things. > > >> > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> > > >> > > >> On Jan 3, 2008 1:13 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner < hans(a)eds.org> wrote: > > > > >> > > >>> > > >>> You should have CVS access now, so if you check this into CVS, then > > it > > >>> shouldn't be too hard to add it to the nightly builds. That > > certainly makes > > >>> it easier for people to test it. > > >>> > > >>> .hc > > >>> > > >>> On Jan 2, 2008, at 8:19 AM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Ed, > > >>> > > >>> I really doubt that anyone has tried this yet, as this is just the > > first > > >>> release, and even that is very preliminary. We are still trying to > > get the > > >>> programming interface down in PD. > > >>> You may be able to try taking a basic makefile from some other > > external. > > >>> The only difference here is that you also need to compile the > > Sqlite3 code > > >>> into an object file. It then gets linked up with the SQLdb object. > > You may, > > >>> depending on what 'warning' you ask for, see a lot of message. I > > have yet to > > >>> find any troubles with the resulting compiled objects. You can check > > with > > >>> the SQLite site for details, but probably won't need to... > > >>> > > >>> I do have access to a Ubuntu (GG) install, so I can try to figure > > >>> something out there, but that won't happen for a few days. > > >>> > > >>> BUT, if anyone does create a makefile, please forward it to me, and > > I > > >>> can add it to the main makefile. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Mike > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On Jan 2, 2008 9:49 AM, Ed Kelly < morph_2016(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > > >>> > > >>>> Hi there, > > >>>> > > >>>> has anyone had any experience of compiling Mogo's SQLdb v0.0 for > > >>>> linux? The makefile refers to the OSX SDK... > > >>>> > > >>>> peace, > > >>>> Ed > > >>>> > > >>>> Lone Shark "Aviation" out now on http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com > > > > >>>> http://www.myspace.com/sharktracks > > >>>> > > >>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>> Support the World Aids Awareness campaign this month with Yahoo! > > for > > >>>> Good<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/… > > > > > >>>> > > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>> PD-list(a)iem.at mailing list > > >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> Peace may sound simple?one beautiful word? but it requires > > everything we > > >>> have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. > > >>> ?Yehudi Menuhin (1916?1999), musician > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> PD-list(a)iem.at mailing list > > >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>> > > >>> Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a > > more > > >>> direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, > > it can > > >>> change entire economies. - Amy Smith > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Peace may sound simple?one beautiful word? but it requires everything > > we > > >> have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. > > >> ?Yehudi Menuhin (1916?1999), musician > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Peace may sound simple?one beautiful word? but it requires everything > > we > > > have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. > > > ?Yehudi Menuhin (1916?1999), musician > > > > > > > zen > > \ > > \ > > \ [D [D [D [D > > > > > > -- > Peace may sound simple—one beautiful word— but it requires everything we > have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. > —Yehudi Menuhin (1916–1999), musician > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > 'You people have such restrictive dress for women,' she said, hobbling > away in three inch heels and panty hose to finish out another pink-collar > temp pool day. - "Hijab Scene #2", by Mohja Kahf > > > -- Peace may sound simple—one beautiful word— but it requires everything we have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. —Yehudi Menuhin (1916–1999), musician

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Re: [PD] Pd + asterisk?
by Russell Bryant 04 Jan '08

04 Jan '08

Christian GrÃ¶ger wrote: > Hey, > > thanks for this, I just tried it, it works (kind of)... Thank _you_ for trying it out! >> 1) Install my branch of Asterisk that contains app_jack. >> >> $ svn co http://svn.digium.com/svn/asterisk/team/russell/jack asterisk-jack >> $ cd asterisk-jack >> $ ./configure && make >> $ sudo make install >> >> The jack interface is in apps/app_jack.c in case anyone cares. >> > There was the first problem, app_jack somehow didn't build without any > errors, configure said jack...h was there, but there was no app_jack.so > build. I had to do a 'make menuconfig' and disable+reenable app_jack. Hm, that's odd. The build system should automatically include it if jack was found on the system. I'll have to play around with it to see if it happens to me ... >> 3) Make sure jackd is running. For the sake of efficiency, specify 8 kHz, >> because for most codecs used for phone calls, that's all you get. Also, specify >> 160 frames per period. For 8 kHz audio, this comes out to 20 ms periods, which >> is generally the packet size used for Voice over IP. >> >> $ sudo jackd -d dummy -r 8000 -p 160 >> > I used 128 frames, this sounded a bit better. But I think it would be > much better if app_jack would adapt to the running jack. I sometimes use > jack for connecting to a firewire-soundcard and with 8KHz it's > impossible to have good sound out of your speakers ;) The short answer is that I have all intentions to make app_jack work transparently with any period size and sample rate used by jack itself. Longer response ... In theory, any period size should work just fine. I just happened to choose 160 because I was thinking that it would be more efficient, since that was the period size of packets coming through Asterisk. However, due to the way audio is passed between Asterisk and jack, it really shouldn't matter at all. All of the raw audio goes through ringbuffers that have no concept of a period. I will play around with different period sizes to see if I can cause a problem to occur. Also, I have all intentions to support more than 8 kHz mode for jack. :) The trick is, with 8 kHz, app_jack doesn't have to resample anything. With any other sample rate, it does. I have code that attempts to handle resampling the audio in both directions using libresample. However, it currently makes the audio sound absolutely terrible. I'll get it fixed, though ... >> 4) Make a call to the extension created in Asterisk in step 2. You should see >> the two new jack ports become available. In theory, they are available for >> connection to any application that can use Jack. The only thing I have done so >> far is to use the "patchage" application to connect the ports directly together >> to verify that the audio is flowing correctly. >> > I tried Pd and had some strange problems (I don't know where they come > from) No problem if you connect adc~ from Asterisk to dac~ on Asterisk, > I hear myself with a rather extreme echo. But I can't hear a simple osc~ > on the phone, neither can I hear myself on my PC-speakers when I talk > into the phone. Would you mind sharing the Pd patch that you were using to test this out? The extreme echo is a good sign, I think. I assume you mean you just heard your own voice coming back to you, with some delay. Anything beyond that is probably acoustic echo with whatever phone you're using. :) The reason that connecting Asterisk to itself works but not with anything else could have something to do with the way I did sample value normalization in Asterisk. Asterisk uses a 16 bit integer representation per sample. However, I had to convert it to float for jack. I wasn't sure of the right way to do it, so I simply scaled the values based on the maximum values of the type ... (f_buf is a buffer of floats, s_buf is a buffer of int16_t's) for (i = 0; i < f->samples; i++) f_buf[i] = s_buf[i] * (FLT_MAX / SHRT_MAX); >> Now, to figure out how to hook up arbitrary jack ports to Pd ... if anyone has >> any pointers, it would be much appreciated. I'm still very new to Pd. :) >> >> > You could do this in Asterisk with a System(jack_connect ...) ;) > Do you think it would be possible to tell app_jack to connect to > jack-server running as Pid x? Jack sometimes screws up your system when > it runs as root, or other software does, because it has to run as root > too. I configured my Asterisk to run as myself, but that's quite complex. The System() option is certainly amusing. Hey, if it works, why not. I think what I want to do eventually is be able to send a message that you could receive in a Pd patch that a new pair of jack ports has become available. But, that's not as important to me right now as getting the audio flow working properly. I don't know about adding an argument that says connect to PID X. However, there appears to be an option in the jack C API which allows you to specify a server name to connect to. That may do what is needed to connect to jackd running as a different user. Thanks for the suggestions. > Anyway, it's cool you coded all this, thanks. Thanks for the kind words, and for the testing! Hopefully I can get it working well and make it easy to use. I will work on incorporating your suggestions. -- Russell Bryant

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pd-extended 64-bit
by patrick 03 Jan '08

03 Jan '08

hi, i am trying to build pd-extended for 64-bit. OSCx sendOSC.c: In function Â‘sendOSC_settypetagsÂ’: sendOSC.c:186: warning: cast from pointer to integer of different size cc -g -O2 -DUNIX -Wall -Wimplicit -Wunused -Wmissing-prototypes -O1 -I../libOSC -I../../pd/src -I../../../pd/src -I../src -I../libOSC -I../../pd/src -I../../../pd/src -I../src -c -o htmsocket.o htmsocket.c htmsocket.c:107: warning: no previous prototype for Â‘IsAddressMulticastÂ’ cc -g -O2 -DUNIX -Wall -Wimplicit -Wunused -Wmissing-prototypes -O1 -I../libOSC -I../../pd/src -I../../../pd/src -I../src -I../libOSC -I../../pd/src -I../../../pd/src -I../src -c -o OSC-system-dependent.o OSC-system-dependent.c OSC-system-dependent.c: In function Â‘fatal_errorÂ’: OSC-system-dependent.c:65: warning: implicit declaration of function Â‘exitÂ’ OSC-system-dependent.c:65: warning: incompatible implicit declaration of built-in function Â‘exitÂ’ cc -Wl,-export_dynamic -shared -o sendOSC.pd_linux sendOSC.o htmsocket.o OSC-system-dependent.o -L../../../pd/bin -lpd -lc -lm ../libOSC/libOSC.a /usr/bin/ld: sendOSC.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC sendOSC.o: could not read symbols: Bad value collect2: ld returned 1 exit status make[4]: *** [sendOSC.pd_linux] Error 1 make[4]: Leaving directory `/home/pat/src/pure-data/externals/OSCx/src' make[3]: *** [all] Error 2 make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/pat/src/pure-data/externals/OSCx' make[2]: *** [/home/pat/src/pure-data/externals/OSCx/src/OSCroute.pd_linux] Error 2 gem2pdp gcc -export_dynamic -shared -o gem2pdp.pd_linux gem2pdp.o yuv.o -lm /usr/bin/ld: gem2pdp.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC gem2pdp.o: could not read symbols: Bad value cyclone /usr/bin/ld: hammer/accum.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC hammer/accum.o: could not read symbols: Bad value pddp /usr/bin/ld: pddplink.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC pddplink.o: could not read symbols: Bad value toxy /usr/bin/ld: tot.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC tot.o: could not read symbols: Bad value pidip /usr/bin/ld: modules/pdp_aging.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC modules/pdp_aging.o: could not read symbols: Bad value i compiled extended with pd 0.41 test 10 not patched. the question is: recompile with -fPIC i would like to try it. where should i modify the Makefile? pat

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xsample 64-bit
by patrick 03 Jan '08

03 Jan '08

hi thomas, i did a video of the bug so you can ear the problem. normally setting the speed to 1 is the original pitch... http://www.workinprogress.ca/pd/xsample.ogg http://www.workinprogress.ca/pd/xsample2.ogg (vlc, mplayer...) pat

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Pd-list January 2008