Hi Pd-dev, (Hi Hans! Hi Dan!)
It's been a while since I was here. I just quit my job and intend to spend some time making music boxes. Pd is in my future.
There's a couple of things I'd like to spend some time on:
1. I'd like to elminate the clicking that you get when making live edits to a patch.
2. I'd like to get as much of the DSP chain as possible into a threadsafe state.
Are there any plans around these? Design docs or discussions? Is this on anyone's radar?
Thanks Damian -- damian stewart . digitaler fuzzi . vienna, austria http://damianstewart.com . twitter @damian0815
There is some talk of adding extra outputs to the inlet~ object, one of which indicates dsp connectivity. If this were in there you could use that information to envelope signals as they are connected into the dsp graph thus eliminating clicks.. You'd still have to connect the output first, or at least connect through another envelope controlled section. This also wouldn't help when you sum into that same signal input, but it is a very unobtrusive way to allow for this without a major revamp. Alex
On March 15, 2017 4:35:18 PM PDT, Damian Stewart lists@damianstewart.com wrote:
Hi Pd-dev, (Hi Hans! Hi Dan!)
It's been a while since I was here. I just quit my job and intend to spend some time making music boxes. Pd is in my future.
There's a couple of things I'd like to spend some time on:
- I'd like to elminate the clicking that you get when making live
edits to a patch.
- I'd like to get as much of the DSP chain as possible into a
threadsafe state.
Are there any plans around these? Design docs or discussions? Is this on anyone's radar?
Thanks Damian -- damian stewart . digitaler fuzzi . vienna, austria http://damianstewart.com . twitter @damian0815
Pd-dev mailing list Pd-dev@lists.iem.at https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
Hi Pd-dev,
(Hi Hans! Hi Dan!)
It's been a while since I was here. I just quit my job and intend to spend some
time making music boxes. Pd is in my future.
There's a couple of things I'd like to spend some time on:
- I'd like to elminate the clicking that you get when making live edits to a patch.
These typically come from three sources:1) rebuilding the dsp graph when you make a change to it2) walking the list of objects in a glist 3) sending too much data to the GUI over the socket #1 currently the dsp graph is just a big, flat array of function&argument pointers. It would require substantial changes to only rebuild subsections of it.
#2 every time you move the mouse (plus some other events like clicking) Pd walks the list of canvas objects, either until it finds an object under the mouse or hits the end. Run Pd with the "-d 3" flag and you will see how often Pd does this when editing a patch. The list of objects is a linked list which, as Bjarne Stroustrup has said, "optimizes for cache misses". But more importantly, all that work happens in the same process as the audio engine instead of inside the GUI toolkit where it should be. Moving this work to the GUI is not trivial, especially because Pd has no formal specification.
#3 The current graphical processing code in the g_*.c files is very chatty and unoptimized. When you move a selection of 100 objects by one pixel, all 100 objects send a message to the GUI to move the corresponding tagged tk canvas items by 1 pixel. In Vanilla I believe garrays are still redrawn every time you move them which makes things even worse. Also, every time you paste text into a box each character is sent separately to the audio process, concatenated, then sent back to the GUI to display. So you get exponential explosion there. There are probably other places where this happens... -Jonathan
2. I'd like to get as much of the DSP chain as possible into a threadsafe state.
Are there any plans around these? Design docs or discussions? Is this on anyone's radar?
Thanks Damian -- damian stewart . digitaler fuzzi . vienna, austria http://damianstewart.com . twitter @damian0815
_______________________________________________ Pd-dev mailing list Pd-dev@lists.iem.at https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
On 03/16/2017 04:22 PM, Jonathan Wilkes via Pd-dev wrote:
- I'd like to elminate the clicking that you get when making live edits to a patch.
These typically come from three sources:1) rebuilding the dsp graph when you make a change to it2) walking the list of objects in a glist 3) sending too much data to the GUI over the socket
there's a 4th: when you save an abstraction, all sibling instances (and all objects therein) get re-instantiated. on reinstantiation they forget their internal state, which leads to phase-discontinuities: audible clicks. there might be a way around this building on infinite undo.
gfmdars IOhannes
-
Alex Norman -
Damian Stewart -
Jonathan Wilkes -
zmoelnig＠iem.at