Hey all,
Now that IOhannes pulled off the SVN switch, (yay!), we have everything in the trunk. I would like to propose some moves:
trunk/Framestein --> trunk/externals/framestein trunk/supercollider --> trunk/externals/supercollider
trunk/xgui --> trunk/extensions/xgui
.hc
------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----
I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can have three meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for their minds, and dignity, equality and freedom for their spirits. - Martin Luther King, Jr.
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Hey all,
Now that IOhannes pulled off the SVN switch, (yay!), we have everything in the trunk. I would like to propose some moves:
trunk/Framestein --> trunk/externals/framestein
i would even move this into tags/externals/Framestein (or /branches of /discontinued) Framestein has its own repository on sourceforge, and both the one in puredata and it's own have not been updated for 4 years.
trunk/supercollider --> trunk/externals/supercollider
trunk/xgui --> trunk/extensions/xgui
i basically agree, though supercollider should probably go into the "extensions" folder too.
fgamdrs IOhannes
On Feb 7, 2008, at 2:43 PM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Hey all, Now that IOhannes pulled off the SVN switch, (yay!), we have everything in the trunk. I would like to propose some moves: trunk/Framestein --> trunk/externals/framestein
i would even move this into tags/externals/Framestein (or /branches of /discontinued) Framestein has its own repository on sourceforge, and both the one in puredata and it's own have not been updated for 4 years.
How does /branches/discontinued work? that sounds like a good choice for Framestein.
trunk/supercollider --> trunk/externals/supercollider trunk/xgui --> trunk/extensions/xgui
i basically agree, though supercollider should probably go into the "extensions" folder too.
"extensions" was meant for GUI extensions like xgui and gripd. AFAIK, "supercollider" is an external for interfacing to SuperCollider with Pd.
.hc
------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----
The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Feb 7, 2008, at 2:43 PM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Hey all, Now that IOhannes pulled off the SVN switch, (yay!), we have everything in the trunk. I would like to propose some moves: trunk/Framestein --> trunk/externals/framestein
i would even move this into tags/externals/Framestein (or /branches of /discontinued) Framestein has its own repository on sourceforge, and both the one in puredata and it's own have not been updated for 4 years.
How does /branches/discontinued work? that sounds like a good choice for Framestein.
well, nothing special; it is a folder where discontinued projects can be moved to, so they don't fill up the "trunk". the folder could also be called "deprecated" (but this is so negative)
otoh, why bother creating an extra space for the few projects like that? tagging/branching a discontinued project is probably enough (in my original post there was a typo: it shout read "/branches or /discontinued" (both relative to the svnroot) rather than "/branches of /discontinued")
so Framestein should probably go into "/tags/externals/Framestein" and be left there forever.
trunk/supercollider --> trunk/externals/supercollider trunk/xgui --> trunk/extensions/xgui
i basically agree, though supercollider should probably go into the "extensions" folder too.
"extensions" was meant for GUI extensions like xgui and gripd. AFAIK, "supercollider" is an external for interfacing to SuperCollider with Pd.
i did not know that "extensions" was GUI related... anyhow, i thought (having never used it), the "supercollider" is more like a framework to get sc3 and Pd work together nicely (with a Pd-part and an sc3-part); but i've never used it, so i might be easily mistaken.
i think the key point of both of us is, that all 3 of them should be moved out of "/trunk"
fgamdr. IOhannes
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
How does /branches/discontinued work? that sounds like a good choice for Framestein.
well, nothing special; it is a folder where discontinued projects can be moved to, so they don't fill up the "trunk". the folder could also be called "deprecated" (but this is so negative)
Discontinued projects and deprecated projects are not the same. As an excellent example, the GZIP project was mostly left "undeveloped" for over 10 years. So what? there was no need to release anything. From the moment it stopped being developed until the next bugfix, its popularity increased perhaps 100-fold or 1000-fold.
If an external/extension/module is perfect as it is, there's no reason to change it, and it can be as discontinued as you want, it's still working.
I agree that Framestein seems to have fallen out of fashion, but "discontinued" is not the criterion of exclusion that you are looking for.
"extensions" was meant for GUI extensions like xgui and gripd. AFAIK, "supercollider" is an external for interfacing to SuperCollider with Pd.
i did not know that "extensions" was GUI related...
I don't think that it was meant for GUI at all. It happened to collect that because the name "extensions" is more generic than what has been traditionally called "externals" in pd, so, it collects anything that is "external" in the non-pd meaning of "external" but is not a shared library.
Anyway, if it was really meant for GUI, it never was clear, and I think that my explanation about the origin of the name "extensions" is perfectly reasonable.
anyhow, i thought (having never used it), the "supercollider" is more like a framework to get sc3 and Pd work together nicely (with a Pd-part and an sc3-part); but i've never used it, so i might be easily mistaken. i think the key point of both of us is, that all 3 of them should be moved out of "/trunk"
Is that "supercollider" component broken or obsolete? AFAIK, SC3 sounds like it's quite current. It's not like it was made for SC1 or something.
_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada
Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
How does /branches/discontinued work? that sounds like a good choice for Framestein.
well, nothing special; it is a folder where discontinued projects can be moved to, so they don't fill up the "trunk". the folder could also be called "deprecated" (but this is so negative)
Discontinued projects and deprecated projects are not the same. As an excellent example, the GZIP project was mostly left "undeveloped" for over 10 years. So what? there was no need to release anything. From the moment it stopped being developed until the next bugfix, its popularity increased perhaps 100-fold or 1000-fold.
If an external/extension/module is perfect as it is, there's no reason to change it, and it can be as discontinued as you want, it's still working.
I agree that Framestein seems to have fallen out of fashion, but "discontinued" is not the criterion of exclusion that you are looking for.
in my last mail i tried to get away from both "discontinued" and "deprecated" and shift the discussion towards "branches" and "tags". since tags are usually considered to be "frozen" (though technically nothing keeps you from thawing them (in subversion)), they are a positive equivalent to "discontinued".
there is no reason to keep a project like Framestein in the "trunk" (main _development_ branch) of pure-data. whenever it is reactivated, it could just be copied(!) back.
anyhow, i thought (having never used it), the "supercollider" is more like a framework to get sc3 and Pd work together nicely (with a Pd-part and an sc3-part); but i've never used it, so i might be easily mistaken. i think the key point of both of us is, that all 3 of them should be moved out of "/trunk"
Is that "supercollider" component broken or obsolete? AFAIK, SC3 sounds like it's quite current. It's not like it was made for SC1 or something.
first of all, the "sc3" symbol was only introduced by me (thinking that "supercollider" is indeed for sc3) i don't know why you think it might be broken or obsolete.
ahh, i think you might have misunderstood me: i think "Framestein", "supercollider" and "xgui" should be moved away from /trunk/; neither of them has the same importance as "pd" or "externals". (it might be even misleading, to have "supercollider" be in parallel to "pd") i don't think that all 3 should be handled the same (as they are not) my proposal was: /trunk/Framestein -> /tags/externals/Framestein /trunk/xgui -> /trunk/extensions/xgui /trunk/supercollider -> /trunk/extensions/supercollider
after all this talk about "discontinued", i don't know what makes the "supercollider" and "xgui" better than "Framestein" in this respect.
fmgnasdr IOhannes
On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:37 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
How does /branches/discontinued work? that sounds like a good choice for Framestein.
well, nothing special; it is a folder where discontinued projects can be moved to, so they don't fill up the "trunk". the folder could also be called "deprecated" (but this is so negative)
Discontinued projects and deprecated projects are not the same. As an excellent example, the GZIP project was mostly left "undeveloped" for over 10 years. So what? there was no need to release anything. From the moment it stopped being developed until the next bugfix, its popularity increased perhaps 100-fold or 1000- fold.
If an external/extension/module is perfect as it is, there's no reason to change it, and it can be as discontinued as you want, it's still working.
I agree that Framestein seems to have fallen out of fashion, but "discontinued" is not the criterion of exclusion that you are looking for.
I agree that "discontinued" is not a good word. I think "deprecated" is because it is something that someone does. I think we should deprecate Framestein. It hasn't been touched in years, there are better things that replace it, and it probably doesn't even work with current versions of Pd.
"extensions" was meant for GUI extensions like xgui and gripd. AFAIK, "supercollider" is an external for interfacing to SuperCollider with Pd.
i did not know that "extensions" was GUI related...
I don't think that it was meant for GUI at all. It happened to collect that because the name "extensions" is more generic than what has been traditionally called "externals" in pd, so, it collects anything that is "external" in the non-pd meaning of "external" but is not a shared library.
Anyway, if it was really meant for GUI, it never was clear, and I think that my explanation about the origin of the name "extensions" is perfectly reasonable.
I started that section. Sorry for the bad name, it should probably be renamed. It's not really used anyhow.
anyhow, i thought (having never used it), the "supercollider" is more like a framework to get sc3 and Pd work together nicely (with a Pd-part and an sc3-part); but i've never used it, so i might be easily mistaken. i think the key point of both of us is, that all 3 of them should be moved out of "/trunk"
Is that "supercollider" component broken or obsolete? AFAIK, SC3 sounds like it's quite current. It's not like it was made for SC1 or something.
He meant moving it out of the root to somewhere more appropriate, not removing it.
.hc
------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----
"Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free software means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls you." - Richard M. Stallman
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:37 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
Is that "supercollider" component broken or obsolete? AFAIK, SC3 sounds like it's quite current. It's not like it was made for SC1 or something.
He meant moving it out of the root to somewhere more appropriate, not removing it.
Oh. I thought that he meant from the whole /trunk/ hierarchy. I didn't think of /trunk/ as not including its subdirectories...
_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada
-
David Plans Casal -
Hans-Christoph Steiner -
IOhannes m zmoelnig -
Mathieu Bouchard