On Oct 14, 2004, at 6:31 PM, Tim Blechmann wrote:
hi hans
Most great computer languages are largely built using themselves. C, Java, Objective-C, Smalltalk, Forth, etc. etc. These are all languages where most of the APIs and even the compilers are written in the same language. I think Pd should be the same.
i must say, i don't really agree with what you suggest ... building a c-compiler in c is probably a good task for c, but a pd build system in pd? i doubt that something like that would work ...
pd is a language ... and a very powerful language in the fields where it is built for ... but there are tasks where another language might be better ... maybe that's why there are extensions to access c, python, scheme, ruby, forth (... ???) from pd ...
i'm not against patching at all, but there are certain tasks, that can be realized within python or k_cext within 30 minutes, that would take (at least for me) several hours ...
I didn't mean to suggest that we implement a build system in Pd, I wasn't the best example of what I am trying to communicate. I meant that to be an example of the depths that many language designers go to implement the language in that language. I don't mean to say that we need to stop writing Pd objects in C, python, whatever, I just think that we should try to make as much of Pd as possible implemented in Pd.
As for patcher vs. procedural/OO programming, its a very different mindset, and I think its harder to learn a patcher language if you already know procedural or OO programming. But I have recently been pushing myself to try to think in a Pd way when programming with Pd, and try to break the habit of procedural/OO programming. I had a number of minor breakthroughs where I found that when I did things the Pd way, it was actually really quick.
This reminds me of my phases of learning programming. I started with BASIC, line numbers and all, and when I started with procedural programming, it was my habit to write long, convoluted procedures. It took time to learn how to write nice, short procedures. And of course, I had similar experience in the switch from procedural to object-oriented programming.
.hc
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