Please reply to pdweb to continue this discussion.
On 29/07/2008, at 19.36, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
This reminds me, we really need that gallery section on puredata.info to show stuff like this off... It was so close to completion, anyone want to take it live?
First off, i'm the slack bus-hit someone that didn't complete the gallery (ie. the exhibition) section mentioned.
I have been meaning to get back about it, but decided to not do it till i had more solid things to offer then ideas. Well, now i'll have to push in the ideas without the solid stuff. I'll be brief and leave out (most of) my reasons:
* I think the exhibition section should be discarded. It has in parts been replaced by a goto10 project (that reach much wider in scope though) and more importantly - to put it diplomatically - the publishing scheme is not compatible with the target community.
* There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
* Also there should be a concise wiki page with examples of what could be done with Pd. People writing that would want to suppress there ego for a second and think about what newcomers would most- likely want to see when looking into what Pd is by what can be done in Pd. Also therefore it shouldn't seek all the outer limits but include stuff like a simple algo-composing and loop-sampler example.
On Jul 30, 2008, at 2:54 AM, Steffen Juul wrote:
Please reply to pdweb to continue this discussion.
On 29/07/2008, at 19.36, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
This reminds me, we really need that gallery section on puredata.info to show stuff like this off... It was so close to completion, anyone want to take it live?
First off, i'm the slack bus-hit someone that didn't complete the gallery (ie. the exhibition) section mentioned.
I have been meaning to get back about it, but decided to not do it till i had more solid things to offer then ideas. Well, now i'll have to push in the ideas without the solid stuff. I'll be brief and leave out (most of) my reasons:
- I think the exhibition section should be discarded. It has in parts
been replaced by a goto10 project (that reach much wider in scope though) and more importantly - to put it diplomatically - the publishing scheme is not compatible with the target community.
I don't understand what the replacement is?
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This sounds very useful. I think perhaps it could be a module in puredata.info. It could also be a separate server/site if someone else wanted to host it, something like blog.puredata.info. I think IEM does enough, it's good to share the work load. Of course, I have no problem if IEM (namely, IOhannes) wants to host it.
- Also there should be a concise wiki page with examples of what
could be done with Pd. People writing that would want to suppress there ego for a second and think about what newcomers would most- likely want to see when looking into what Pd is by what can be done in Pd. Also therefore it shouldn't seek all the outer limits but include stuff like a simple algo-composing and loop-sampler example.
To me, this sounds like the exhibition as we originally planned it. IIRC, you basically had it setup, we just needed to launch it. The idea of having it curated with a ban on self-posting should help the ego. I think this in conjuction with the blogs would work well.
.hc
Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ listinfo/pd-list
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¡El pueblo unido jamás será vencido!
On 30/07/2008, at 18.07, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Jul 30, 2008, at 2:54 AM, Steffen Juul wrote:
Please reply to pdweb to continue this discussion.
On 29/07/2008, at 19.36, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
This reminds me, we really need that gallery section on puredata.info to show stuff like this off... It was so close to completion, anyone want to take it live?
First off, i'm the slack bus-hit someone that didn't complete the gallery (ie. the exhibition) section mentioned.
I have been meaning to get back about it, but decided to not do it till i had more solid things to offer then ideas. Well, now i'll have to push in the ideas without the solid stuff. I'll be brief and leave out (most of) my reasons:
- I think the exhibition section should be discarded. It has in parts
been replaced by a goto10 project (that reach much wider in scope though) and more importantly - to put it diplomatically - the publishing scheme is not compatible with the target community.
I don't understand what the replacement is?
I was thinking about the people.makeart project, http://goto10.org/ floss-and-art/.
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This sounds very useful. I think perhaps it could be a module in puredata.info. It could also be a separate server/site if someone else wanted to host it, something like blog.puredata.info. I think IEM does enough, it's good to share the work load. Of course, I have no problem if IEM (namely, IOhannes) wants to host it.
I agree with that.
- Also there should be a concise wiki page with examples of what
could be done with Pd. People writing that would want to suppress there ego for a second and think about what newcomers would most- likely want to see when looking into what Pd is by what can be done in Pd. Also therefore it shouldn't seek all the outer limits but include stuff like a simple algo-composing and loop-sampler example.
To me, this sounds like the exhibition as we originally planned it.
Thats the thing, maybe. To me it's different. Both wrt content and publishing "flow".
One thing that was broad up on the pd-list that could go into such exhibition was Frank's Turning machine made in Pd-data-structures, http://footils.org/cms/show/58. Another thing i've was keen on writing about was the Offener Schaltkreis installation, http:// osk.openkhm.de/. Those two might fit into an example-exhibition but only for outer limit cases which, how ever cool and appropriate, should be kept at a minimum. I think.
The publishing flow of a (concise) wiki page with examples of what Pd is by what is done in Pd is almost non existing. It will be a much static page. After initializing there will only once in a while added or removed an item to make it upto date with what people do with it, as i imaging it. An item is an example item. Fx. if there the next five years seam to be a trend about a FooSmerth controller in the "computer music scene" then it would properly be good to add an example about it such that people how might be interested in looking into Pd can see "ah, i can also make a FooLooper with Pd, check". This is quite different then if a completely new article-exhibition is released once a month(ish). An static'ish exmaple-exhibition could easily sit unchanged for two+ years with out a problem, while a article-exhibition project would be considered stall if nothing new happened within the same time span.
I think this in conjuction with the blogs would work well.
I think too that the almost static example-ish wiki page in conjunction with the rapid information flow of blogs would work well. The article-exhibition, as i thought about it, was more like somewhere in between those two and the people.makeart thing - both wrt publishing method and content type, though leaning a tad away from blogs quick'n'dirtyness.
To put it simple, i think, for rapid flow the publishing house need not be the puredata.info site but everyones own website. That's the blog thing. For more static "authentic" info the puredata.info site is better suited. This(/that? pardon my french) analysis backs up the model i'm going on about.
IIRC, you basically had it setup, we just needed to launch it.
True. And if anyone want to cary on with the that model i'm not stopping them. You might think I'm nitpicking, and maybe I am, my reason is that I'm concern with not wasting anyones time and still be able to present this kind of info to both potential new users or curious souls that want to grasp what Pd is.
I hope i make sense. It's kind of hard to explain every side of it that I've thought about in the meanwhile.
On Jul 31, 2008, at 1:58 PM, Steffen Juul wrote:
On 30/07/2008, at 18.07, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Jul 30, 2008, at 2:54 AM, Steffen Juul wrote:
Please reply to pdweb to continue this discussion.
On 29/07/2008, at 19.36, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
This reminds me, we really need that gallery section on puredata.info to show stuff like this off... It was so close to completion, anyone want to take it live?
First off, i'm the slack bus-hit someone that didn't complete the gallery (ie. the exhibition) section mentioned.
I have been meaning to get back about it, but decided to not do it till i had more solid things to offer then ideas. Well, now i'll have to push in the ideas without the solid stuff. I'll be brief and leave out (most of) my reasons:
- I think the exhibition section should be discarded. It has in
parts been replaced by a goto10 project (that reach much wider in scope though) and more importantly - to put it diplomatically - the publishing scheme is not compatible with the target community.
I don't understand what the replacement is?
I was thinking about the people.makeart project, http://goto10.org/ floss-and-art/.
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This sounds very useful. I think perhaps it could be a module in puredata.info. It could also be a separate server/site if someone else wanted to host it, something like blog.puredata.info. I think IEM does enough, it's good to share the work load. Of course, I have no problem if IEM (namely, IOhannes) wants to host it.
I agree with that.
- Also there should be a concise wiki page with examples of what
could be done with Pd. People writing that would want to suppress there ego for a second and think about what newcomers would most- likely want to see when looking into what Pd is by what can be done in Pd. Also therefore it shouldn't seek all the outer limits but include stuff like a simple algo-composing and loop-sampler example.
To me, this sounds like the exhibition as we originally planned it.
Thats the thing, maybe. To me it's different. Both wrt content and publishing "flow".
One thing that was broad up on the pd-list that could go into such exhibition was Frank's Turning machine made in Pd-data-structures, http://footils.org/cms/show/58. Another thing i've was keen on writing about was the Offener Schaltkreis installation, http:// osk.openkhm.de/. Those two might fit into an example-exhibition but only for outer limit cases which, how ever cool and appropriate, should be kept at a minimum. I think.
The publishing flow of a (concise) wiki page with examples of what Pd is by what is done in Pd is almost non existing. It will be a much static page. After initializing there will only once in a while added or removed an item to make it upto date with what people do with it, as i imaging it. An item is an example item. Fx. if there the next five years seam to be a trend about a FooSmerth controller in the "computer music scene" then it would properly be good to add an example about it such that people how might be interested in looking into Pd can see "ah, i can also make a FooLooper with Pd, check". This is quite different then if a completely new article-exhibition is released once a month(ish). An static'ish exmaple-exhibition could easily sit unchanged for two+ years with out a problem, while a article-exhibition project would be considered stall if nothing new happened within the same time span.
I think this in conjuction with the blogs would work well.
I think too that the almost static example-ish wiki page in conjunction with the rapid information flow of blogs would work well. The article-exhibition, as i thought about it, was more like somewhere in between those two and the people.makeart thing - both wrt publishing method and content type, though leaning a tad away from blogs quick'n'dirtyness.
To put it simple, i think, for rapid flow the publishing house need not be the puredata.info site but everyones own website. That's the blog thing. For more static "authentic" info the puredata.info site is better suited. This(/that? pardon my french) analysis backs up the model i'm going on about.
IIRC, you basically had it setup, we just needed to launch it.
True. And if anyone want to cary on with the that model i'm not stopping them. You might think I'm nitpicking, and maybe I am, my reason is that I'm concern with not wasting anyones time and still be able to present this kind of info to both potential new users or curious souls that want to grasp what Pd is.
I hope i make sense. It's kind of hard to explain every side of it that I've thought about in the meanwhile.
From what I understand, you are proposing to strip down the original idea to just this:
- a exhibition section - use a standard exhibition template - anyone can submit an exhibition page - it must be about anything their own work
If so, that sounds good to me. Other things like the blog are good too, I just think that we should get one up before starting another. One finished site, is better than many perfect unfinished sites.
.hc
Pdweb mailing list Pdweb@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pdweb
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As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin
On 02/08/2008, at 5.45, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
From what I understand, you are proposing to strip down the original idea to just this:
- a exhibition section
- use a standard exhibition template
- anyone can submit an exhibition page
- it must be about anything their own work
If so, that sounds good to me.
Not quite what i had in mind. What i had in mind and tried to express was: a wiki page - as in one page with (sub)sections - carrying the entire example-exhibition.
On Aug 12, 2008, at 1:25 AM, Steffen Juul wrote:
On 02/08/2008, at 5.45, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
From what I understand, you are proposing to strip down the original idea to just this:
- a exhibition section
- use a standard exhibition template
- anyone can submit an exhibition page
- it must be about anything their own work
If so, that sounds good to me.
Not quite what i had in mind. What i had in mind and tried to express was: a wiki page - as in one page with (sub)sections - carrying the entire example-exhibition.
You mean one very long wiki page? That would rapidly start to be a problem, I think. Just a one level of hierarchy would make it manageable in the long run. The hierarchy could be based on pages per curator, pages per topic, etc.
Otherwise, just a blog format, that would be in effect one long page. Perhaps that could be the simplest exhibition: a blog with simple rules on the honor system:
- anyone can post any time - one post per person per month - post about any project but your own
.hc
Pdweb mailing list Pdweb@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pdweb
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There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste
Steffen Juul wrote:
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This would be great indeed - decentralization is the way forward.
See http://planet.haskell.org for (just one) example of a community working this way.
Claude
On 01/08/2008, at 4.38, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote:
Steffen Juul wrote:
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This would be great indeed - decentralization is the way forward.
See http://planet.haskell.org for (just one) example of a community working this way.
Maybe we should talk this over then. I suggested a feed syndicator with a bandpass filer of Pd related posts. Planet Planet kind of lets everything through.
What do we want?
On Tue, August 12, 2008 7:22 am, Steffen Juul wrote:
On 01/08/2008, at 4.38, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote:
Steffen Juul wrote:
- There should instead be made weblog sync point for Pd related
weblogs posts á la ProcessingBlogs. It should be simple to manage: Anyone wanting their Pd related weblogs posts to be in the common feed should supply a feed url with a "tag" for the Pd related posts in their feed. Either to a person doing the management (could be done in turns) or if possible through the IEM/Pd.info/plone-setup thing.
This would be great indeed - decentralization is the way forward.
See http://planet.haskell.org for (just one) example of a community working this way.
Maybe we should talk this over then. I suggested a feed syndicator with a bandpass filer of Pd related posts. Planet Planet kind of lets everything through.
What do we want?
Maybe such filtering isn't that trivial. So maybe we should just use Planet Planet. People could be encouraged to make a Pd related feed, if they want.
Question is then where to host it. Would IEM/IOhannes take it?
-
Claude Heiland-Allen -
Hans-Christoph Steiner -
Steffen Juul