Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)
Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets are really ugly.
I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO installer does not do it... ?
b.
The inlets and outlets look normal to me:
It would be nice to have the connections anti-aliases, as long as it
can be done separately from the boxes. Anti-aliasing on the boxes just
makes everything look out of focus.
.hc
On Dec 21, 2005, at 11:40 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I
guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really
deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets are really ugly.I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO installer
does not do it... ?b.
"[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are
deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from
scarcity."
-John Gilmore
Hi Hans,
#1 It looks like my antialiasing settings for the past couple years has simply aliased away my perception of this problem. In fact it has probably been around for longer than that
#2 I think your view of "normal" is not what has been normal for PD (ie not on OSX) check out the following attachments, zoom in real close and take a look. Both are the exact same patch, rendered by OSX and linux.
There is certainly something wonky happening with the tk drawing, some elements are one (yes one) pixel off. I did notice when making connections that even the start of the connection does not start at the outlet, but floating one pixel above it. :(
Summary of weirdness:
- The "rectangle" used to draw a PD inlet is exactly one pixel taller than
the outlet. (huh??) on OSX this means we see the whole in the recangle, exposing that it is a non-filled rectangle
- The line that connects the bottom right corner of a message box to the
inset part seems to extend exactly one pixel past the inset part, giving us a single pixel artifact
- the circle in a bang is really wonky, looks slightly mashed into the
lower-left corner and is totally asymetrical, where on linux the curcle is centered and symetrical.
Yes these are very tight issues (on pixel here and there) but they are distracting me and actually make the PD (clean) interface rather junky. (at least at a low-enough resolution we can see them).
James, could this be an artifact of the new tk drawing instructions? Some things are strange, like the inetets of the IEM guis don't seem to have this same issue as the "original" PD objects.
I just don't understand how the stable version of tk is doing this, I guess we're the only ones left using the "canvas". *sigh*
And yes Hans I agree that the connections really look nice with the AA, and I understand your position. I think it was rather the shock of that the AA was hiding from me that made me so unhappy with having the AA turned off...
so much for consistancy.
b.
On Thu, December 22, 2005 3:34 am, Hans-Christoph Steiner said:
The inlets and outlets look normal to me:
It would be nice to have the connections anti-aliases, as long as it can be done separately from the boxes. Anti-aliasing on the boxes just makes everything look out of focus.
.hc
On Dec 21, 2005, at 11:40 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)
Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets are really ugly.
I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO installer does not do it... ?
b.
"[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore _______________________________________________ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Which versions of Tcl/Tk are you using for these screenshots? There are big differences in how things render on 8.4.4 versus 8.4.9 for example.
.hc
Hi Hans,
#1 It looks like my antialiasing settings for the past couple years has simply aliased away my perception of this problem. In fact it has probably been around for longer than that
#2 I think your view of "normal" is not what has been normal for PD (ie not on OSX) check out the following attachments, zoom in real close and take a look. Both are the exact same patch, rendered by OSX and linux.
There is certainly something wonky happening with the tk drawing, some elements are one (yes one) pixel off. I did notice when making connections that even the start of the connection does not start at the outlet, but floating one pixel above it. :(
Summary of weirdness:
- The "rectangle" used to draw a PD inlet is exactly one pixel taller than
the outlet. (huh??) on OSX this means we see the whole in the recangle, exposing that it is a non-filled rectangle
- The line that connects the bottom right corner of a message box to the
inset part seems to extend exactly one pixel past the inset part, giving us a single pixel artifact
- the circle in a bang is really wonky, looks slightly mashed into the
lower-left corner and is totally asymetrical, where on linux the curcle is centered and symetrical.
Yes these are very tight issues (on pixel here and there) but they are distracting me and actually make the PD (clean) interface rather junky. (at least at a low-enough resolution we can see them).
James, could this be an artifact of the new tk drawing instructions? Some things are strange, like the inetets of the IEM guis don't seem to have this same issue as the "original" PD objects.
I just don't understand how the stable version of tk is doing this, I guess we're the only ones left using the "canvas". *sigh*
And yes Hans I agree that the connections really look nice with the AA, and I understand your position. I think it was rather the shock of that the AA was hiding from me that made me so unhappy with having the AA turned off...
so much for consistancy.
b.
On Thu, December 22, 2005 3:34 am, Hans-Christoph Steiner said:
The inlets and outlets look normal to me:
It would be nice to have the connections anti-aliases, as long as it can be done separately from the boxes. Anti-aliasing on the boxes just makes everything look out of focus.
.hc
On Dec 21, 2005, at 11:40 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)
Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets are really ugly.
I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO installer does not do it... ?
b.
"[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore _______________________________________________ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Hey Hans,
I did not check what version of tk your using in your RC6 (where the "ugly" screenshots came from) Looks like on linux I'm using 8.4.9...
I think think its some tk bug, but damn a few stray pixels are an anoyance, at least for small vector b&w stuff like PD.
b.
hans@eds.org wrote:
Which versions of Tcl/Tk are you using for these screenshots? There are big differences in how things render on 8.4.4 versus 8.4.9 for example.
.hc
Hi Hans,
#1 It looks like my antialiasing settings for the past couple years has simply aliased away my perception of this problem. In fact it has probably been around for longer than that
#2 I think your view of "normal" is not what has been normal for PD (ie not on OSX) check out the following attachments, zoom in real close and take a look. Both are the exact same patch, rendered by OSX and linux.
There is certainly something wonky happening with the tk drawing, some elements are one (yes one) pixel off. I did notice when making connections that even the start of the connection does not start at the outlet, but floating one pixel above it. :(
Summary of weirdness:
- The "rectangle" used to draw a PD inlet is exactly one pixel taller than
the outlet. (huh??) on OSX this means we see the whole in the recangle, exposing that it is a non-filled rectangle
- The line that connects the bottom right corner of a message box to the
inset part seems to extend exactly one pixel past the inset part, giving us a single pixel artifact
- the circle in a bang is really wonky, looks slightly mashed into the
lower-left corner and is totally asymetrical, where on linux the curcle is centered and symetrical.
Yes these are very tight issues (on pixel here and there) but they are distracting me and actually make the PD (clean) interface rather junky. (at least at a low-enough resolution we can see them).
James, could this be an artifact of the new tk drawing instructions? Some things are strange, like the inetets of the IEM guis don't seem to have this same issue as the "original" PD objects.
I just don't understand how the stable version of tk is doing this, I guess we're the only ones left using the "canvas". *sigh*
And yes Hans I agree that the connections really look nice with the AA, and I understand your position. I think it was rather the shock of that the AA was hiding from me that made me so unhappy with having the AA turned off...
so much for consistancy.
b.
On Thu, December 22, 2005 3:34 am, Hans-Christoph Steiner said:
The inlets and outlets look normal to me:
It would be nice to have the connections anti-aliases, as long as it can be done separately from the boxes. Anti-aliasing on the boxes just makes everything look out of focus.
.hc
On Dec 21, 2005, at 11:40 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)
Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets are really ugly.
I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO installer does not do it... ?
b.
"[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore _______________________________________________ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
RC6 is 8.4.9 for Mac OS X, and 8.4.11 for Windows. (FYI: Pd-extended
on GNU/Linux, Tcl/Tk is not included, so its whatever you have
installed)
There have been some other little bugs like that, but I don't know what
the source of them is. I guess I too have just gotten used to them.
.hc
On Dec 23, 2005, at 12:14 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hey Hans,
I did not check what version of tk your using in your RC6 (where the "ugly" screenshots came from) Looks like on linux I'm using 8.4.9...
I think think its some tk bug, but damn a few stray pixels are an anoyance, at least for small vector b&w stuff like PD.
b.
hans@eds.org wrote:
Which versions of Tcl/Tk are you using for these screenshots? There
are big differences in how things render on 8.4.4 versus 8.4.9 for
example..hc
Hi Hans,
#1 It looks like my antialiasing settings for the past couple years
has simply aliased away my perception of this problem. In fact it has
probably been around for longer than that#2 I think your view of "normal" is not what has been normal for PD
(ie not on OSX) check out the following attachments, zoom in real close
and take a look. Both are the exact same patch, rendered by OSX and
linux.There is certainly something wonky happening with the tk drawing,
some elements are one (yes one) pixel off. I did notice when making
connections that even the start of the connection does not start at the outlet,
but floating one pixel above it. :(Summary of weirdness:
- The "rectangle" used to draw a PD inlet is exactly one pixel
taller than the outlet. (huh??) on OSX this means we see the whole in the
recangle, exposing that it is a non-filled rectangle
- The line that connects the bottom right corner of a message box to
the inset part seems to extend exactly one pixel past the inset part,
giving us a single pixel artifact
- the circle in a bang is really wonky, looks slightly mashed into
the lower-left corner and is totally asymetrical, where on linux the
curcle is centered and symetrical.Yes these are very tight issues (on pixel here and there) but they
are distracting me and actually make the PD (clean) interface rather
junky. (at least at a low-enough resolution we can see them).James, could this be an artifact of the new tk drawing instructions?
Some things are strange, like the inetets of the IEM guis don't seem to
have this same issue as the "original" PD objects.I just don't understand how the stable version of tk is doing this, I guess we're the only ones left using the "canvas". *sigh*
And yes Hans I agree that the connections really look nice with the
AA, and I understand your position. I think it was rather the shock of
that the AA was hiding from me that made me so unhappy with having the AA turned off...so much for consistancy.
b.
On Thu, December 22, 2005 3:34 am, Hans-Christoph Steiner said:
The inlets and outlets look normal to me:
It would be nice to have the connections anti-aliases, as long as it can be done separately from the boxes. Anti-aliasing on the boxes
just makes everything look out of focus..hc
On Dec 21, 2005, at 11:40 AM, B. Bogart wrote:
Hi again hans,
trying to use RC6 rather than pixelTANGO on the g5 here at work. (I guess you include a g4 Gem binary in there?)
Anyhow why are inlets drawn twice as big as outlets? I could really deal with the lack of antialiasing on the patch-cords, but the inlets
are really ugly.I don't see this on any other platforms, and my pixelTANGO
installer does not do it... ?b.
"[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore _______________________________________________ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management ->
http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to
realize his wishes.
Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish.
-William Carlos
Williams
yeah mine ends up like that too. at first it was a bit unsettling, but i got used to it.
is it ok just to upgrade tcl/tk ?? i'm not going to have to reinstall pd am i?
-
B. Bogart -
Hans-Christoph Steiner -
hans＠eds.org
-
hard off