hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat RGB32' the the pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera is either too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in pdp_v4l, or has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its special features. this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is called 'pwc' and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240 compared to 10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras supported by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the video window. Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an image in an example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is what I get in the terminal window after creating a window opening pdp_v4l and banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck. I can see the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat RGB32' the the pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera is either too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in pdp_v4l, or has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its special features. this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is called 'pwc' and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240 compared to 10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras supported by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the video window. Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an image in an example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is what I get in the terminal window after creating a window opening pdp_v4l and banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck. I can see the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
I'm using iSweet FW webcam, it works really well with 320x240, nearly with no delay, I've brought that from a fake japanese company in the US.
BTW, I'm using mac osx 10.3.4
於 26 Jul 04 11:36 PM 時,jim ruxton 提到:
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat RGB32' the the pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera is either too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in pdp_v4l, or has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its special features. this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is called 'pwc' and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240 compared to 10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras supported by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the video window. Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an image in an example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is what I get in the terminal window after creating a window opening pdp_v4l and banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck. I can see the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels 1 maxw 352 maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
slimboyfatboyslim http://www.slimboyfatboyslim.org
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a few problems when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat
RGB32' the the
pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera
is either
too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in
pdp_v4l, or
has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its
special features.
this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is
called 'pwc'
and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in
the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240
compared to
10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras
supported
by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the
video window.
Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an
image in an
example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is
what I get
in the terminal window after creating a window opening
pdp_v4l and
banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck.
I can see
the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
i use an aiptek mobile v-cam ( modulo ov511 ), but i don't use much pdp/pidip myself, some friends do ( laughters )
suerte, sevy
Ian Smith-Heisters wrote:
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a few problems when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat
RGB32' the the
pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera
is either
too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in
pdp_v4l, or
has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its
special features.
this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is
called 'pwc'
and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in
the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240
compared to
10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras
supported
by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the
video window.
Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an
image in an
example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is
what I get
in the terminal window after creating a window opening
pdp_v4l and
banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck.
I can see
the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
with pwc/pwcx 2.4/2.6 kernels:
Philips ToUcam Pro is very fine (not produced anymore, ebay?) Philips ToUcam Pro II is very fine (around 80 euros) Philips ToUcam Fun II is not working properly (image reversed, random crash, huge slowdowns) (around 60 euros)
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 20:10:52 +0200 Yves Degoyon ydegoyon@free.fr wrote:
i use an aiptek mobile v-cam ( modulo ov511 ), but i don't use much pdp/pidip myself, some friends do ( laughters )
suerte, sevy
Ian Smith-Heisters wrote:
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a few problems when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat
RGB32' the the
pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera
is either
too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in
pdp_v4l, or
has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its
special features.
this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is
called 'pwc'
and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in
the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240
compared to
10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras
supported
by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the
video window.
Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an
image in an
example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is
what I get
in the terminal window after creating a window opening
pdp_v4l and
banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck.
I can see
the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
Thank you everyone for your suggestions of webcams. I bought a Quickam 4000 Pro and it works well with PDP and PiDip. Although I am getting a glitch in the video about every second. I think I just have to experiment with the settings. Thanks especially to Tom and Yves for a couple of great Externals. Jim
with pwc/pwcx 2.4/2.6 kernels:
Philips ToUcam Pro is very fine (not produced anymore, ebay?) Philips ToUcam Pro II is very fine (around 80 euros) Philips ToUcam Fun II is not working properly (image reversed, random crash, huge slowdowns) (around 60 euros)
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 20:10:52 +0200 Yves Degoyon ydegoyon@free.fr wrote:
i use an aiptek mobile v-cam ( modulo ov511 ), but i don't use much pdp/pidip myself, some friends do ( laughters )
suerte, sevy
Ian Smith-Heisters wrote:
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a few problems when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that they are using with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera (same driver as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I haven't seen any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So anyone using the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat
RGB32' the the
pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera
is either
too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly assumed in
pdp_v4l, or
has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck. maybe i will support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent hardware, but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its
special features.
this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is
called 'pwc'
and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in
the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible to have a relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240
compared to
10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can see, it's the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras
supported
by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the
video window.
Any thoughts where I should start to look. Jim
I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an
image in an
example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is
what I get
in the terminal window after creating a window opening
pdp_v4l and
banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck.
I can see
the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux is ok. Any thought where I should start to look for problems. I'm using a logitech usb based webcam. Jim Sample width set to 2 bytes PDP: pure data packet PDP: version 0.12.3 pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: no device opened pdp_v4l: attempting auto open pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels
1 maxw 352
maxh 292 minw 32 minh 32 pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor pdp_v4l: auto open failed
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
Yeah, I have the same glitch sometimes. Sometimes reloading the driver (modprobe remove pwc, pwcx then modprobe it back in) gets rid of the glitch. Also make sure it's on a high speed USB port. My computer has four ports, but I think only three buses, so two of the ports are full speed USB 2.0 and the others are one fullspeed split in two (or at least that's what it seems like, I haven't verified this). Or maybe futzing with pwcx will help. It seems to happen to me after I've opened a connection to the camera and then closed it, then the next time I connect it's glitchy, so trying to not disconnect, but rather just hiding it might help too.
Cheers, Ian
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 11:36 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thank you everyone for your suggestions of webcams. I bought a Quickam 4000 Pro and it works well with PDP and PiDip. Although I am getting a glitch in the video about every second. I think I just have to experiment with the settings. Thanks especially to Tom and Yves for a couple of great Externals. Jim
with pwc/pwcx 2.4/2.6 kernels:
Philips ToUcam Pro is very fine (not produced anymore,
ebay?) Philips
ToUcam Pro II is very fine (around 80 euros) Philips ToUcam
Fun II is
not working properly (image reversed, random crash, huge slowdowns) (around 60 euros)
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 20:10:52 +0200 Yves Degoyon ydegoyon@free.fr wrote:
i use an aiptek mobile v-cam ( modulo ov511 ), but i
don't use much
pdp/pidip myself, some friends do ( laughters )
suerte, sevy
Ian Smith-Heisters wrote:
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a
few problems
when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at
[mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf
Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that
they are using
with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera
(same driver
as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I
haven't seen
any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So
anyone using
the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
hi jim,
try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat
RGB32' the the
pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera
is either
too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly
assumed in
pdp_v4l, or
has a broken driver.
if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck.
maybe i will
support it later, but that's no priority for me now.
consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent
hardware,
but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its
special features.
this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is
called 'pwc'
and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in
the 'pwcx' module.
they have built-in compression which makes it possible
to have a
relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240
compared to
10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other driver/camera combinations that can do this.
and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can
see, it's
the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra mile..
see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras
supported
by the pwc/pwcx driver.
cheers,
tom
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote:
>I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the >
>video window.
>Any thoughts where I should start to look. >Jim > >I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an >
>image in an
>example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is >
>what I get
>in the terminal window after creating a window opening >
>pdp_v4l and
>banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck. >
>I can see
>the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux
is ok. Any
>thought where I should start to look for problems.
I'm using a
>logitech usb based webcam. >Jim >Sample width set to 2 bytes >PDP: pure data packet >PDP: version 0.12.3 >pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 >pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 >pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels >
>1 maxw 352
>maxh >292 minw 32 minh 32 >pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 >pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 >pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 >pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 >pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 >pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 >pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 >pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument >pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor >pdp_v4l: no device opened >pdp_v4l: attempting auto open >pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 >pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels >
>1 maxw 352
>maxh >292 minw 32 minh 32 >pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 >pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 >pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 >pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 >pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 >pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 >pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 >pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument >pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 >pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor >pdp_v4l: auto open failed > >
>
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
yeah same problem here, never found out why ... looks like the device is not closed properly ...
anyway the workaround (no need to use modprobe):
On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 12:50:02 -0400 "Ian Smith-Heisters" heisters@0x09.com wrote:
Yeah, I have the same glitch sometimes. Sometimes reloading the driver (modprobe remove pwc, pwcx then modprobe it back in) gets rid of the glitch. Also make sure it's on a high speed USB port. My computer has four ports, but I think only three buses, so two of the ports are full speed USB 2.0 and the others are one fullspeed split in two (or at least that's what it seems like, I haven't verified this). Or maybe futzing with pwcx will help. It seems to happen to me after I've opened a connection to the camera and then closed it, then the next time I connect it's glitchy, so trying to not disconnect, but rather just hiding it might help too.
Cheers, Ian
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at [mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf Of jim ruxton Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 11:36 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thank you everyone for your suggestions of webcams. I bought a Quickam 4000 Pro and it works well with PDP and PiDip. Although I am getting a glitch in the video about every second. I think I just have to experiment with the settings. Thanks especially to Tom and Yves for a couple of great Externals. Jim
with pwc/pwcx 2.4/2.6 kernels:
Philips ToUcam Pro is very fine (not produced anymore,
ebay?) Philips
ToUcam Pro II is very fine (around 80 euros) Philips ToUcam
Fun II is
not working properly (image reversed, random crash, huge slowdowns) (around 60 euros)
On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 20:10:52 +0200 Yves Degoyon ydegoyon@free.fr wrote:
i use an aiptek mobile v-cam ( modulo ov511 ), but i
don't use much
pdp/pidip myself, some friends do ( laughters )
suerte, sevy
Ian Smith-Heisters wrote:
Quickcam 4000 works like a dream for me. There were a
few problems
when kernel 2.6 first came out, but the pwc drivers are at 9.0.1 now, and look like they'll run nicely.
-----Original Message----- From: pd-list-admin@iem.at
[mailto:pd-list-admin@iem.at] On Behalf
Of jim ruxton Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:37 A Cc: pd list Subject: Re: [PD] pdp and webcams
Thanks Tom, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a camera that
they are using
with pdp/pidip . I've tried using the Labtec camera
(same driver
as Logitech Quickcam express) which works with Gem (extremely slow) but not pdp. Tom suggested a camera with the Phillips Chipset. I
haven't seen
any Phillips cameras here but it appears that the Logitech Quickcam 3000 and 4000 use the Phillips chipset. So
anyone using
the Logitech Quickcam 3000 or 4000 with pdp?? Has anyone got the Labtech camera to work with pdp. Thanks, Jim On Sun, 2004-07-25 at 16:49, Tom Schouten wrote:
>hi jim, > >try to send a 'captureformat RGB24' or 'captureformat >
> RGB32' the the>pdp_v4l object. if that doesn't help, it means your camera >
> is either>too new (and has only a video4linux2 driver), or it doesn't >support double buffered capturing, which is implicitly
assumed in
>
> pdp_v4l, or>has a broken driver. > >if it's the double buffering, it means you're stuck.
maybe i will
>support it later, but that's no priority for me now. > >consider buying a camera with a philips chipset. they are a >little more expensive, but it's worth it. it's decent
hardware,
>but more importantly, there's a good driver that supports its >
> special features.>this driver is explicitly supported in pdp. the driver is >
> called 'pwc'>and is in the kernel. the proprietary codec is supported in >
> the 'pwcx' module.>they have built-in compression which makes it possible
to have a
>relatively high framerate for a webcam: 27fps at 320x240 >
> compared to>10 for the cheap ones. i don't know if there are any other >driver/camera combinations that can do this. > >and no, i'm not payed by philips, but as far as i can
see, it's
>the only thing that really works well, despite the fact that >there's non-open source part that makes it go that extra
mile..>>
>see http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/ for a list of cameras >
> supported>by the pwc/pwcx driver. > >cheers, > >tom > > >On Sun, 25 Jul 2004, jim ruxton wrote: > >
> >>I'm still trying to figure out why nothing is in the >>
>> video window.>>Any thoughts where I should start to look. >>Jim >> >>I thought I had succeeded but when I try to look for an >>
>> image in an>>example patch (input_output.pd) I don't see it. Below is >>
>> what I get>>in the terminal window after creating a window opening >>
>> pdp_v4l and>>banging it once. I tried pdp_xv and pdp_glx with no luck. >>
>> I can see>>the video with Gem and xawtv so I think video4linux
is ok. Any
>>thought where I should start to look for problems.
I'm using a
>>logitech usb based webcam. >>Jim >>Sample width set to 2 bytes >>PDP: pure data packet >>PDP: version 0.12.3 >>pdp_xvideo: grabbed port 61 on adaptor 0 >>pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 >>pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels >>
>> 1 maxw 352>>maxh >>292 minw 32 minh 32 >>pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 >>pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 >>pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 >>pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 >>pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 >>pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 >>pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 >>pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument >>pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor >>pdp_v4l: no device opened >>pdp_v4l: attempting auto open >>pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0 >>pdp_v4l: cap: name Logitech USB Camera type 513 channels >>
>> 1 maxw 352>>maxh >>292 minw 32 minh 32 >>pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32767 depth 24 palette 4 >>pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera type 2 flags 0 >>pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0 >>pdp_v4l: set norm to 0 >>pdp_v4l: buffer size 426240, frames 1, offset 0 0 >>pdp_v4l: using VIDEO_PALETTE_YUV422 >>pdp_v4l: frame 0 0, format 7, width 320, height 240 >>pdp_v4l: Opened video connection (320x240) >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE: Invalid argument >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCMCAPTURE2: Invalid argument >>pdp_v4l: frame 1 1, format 7, width 320, height 240 >>pdp_v4l: VIDIOCSYNC: Bad file descriptor >>pdp_v4l: auto open failed >> >>
>> > >_______________________________________________ >PD-list mailing list >PD-list@iem.at >to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see >http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list > >
> _______________________________________________ PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list
PD-list mailing list PD-list@iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://iem.at/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pd-list