2015-06-12 3:34 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan@xs4all.nl>:

Hi Alexandre,

> Howdy, maybe this got lost amongst the millions of message I've been
> sending, sorry to insist, but I'm really curious about it.
>
> Moreover, as long as we're on it, I've been creating some abstractions
> as clones of max objects, I was able to do most of these nestles, and
> also [scale] / [scale~] and I just did [rect~] and [tri~]. I wonder if I
> could propose them to be included in cyclone, or if it has to be objects.

The last days I have been looking at what could be done with the
original nettles. In the end it was quite simple to get them working as
a library object and create a suitable help-patch. Both are checked in
in svn, but the original cyclone build system will not build the
library. Katja created a new makefile system as a drop-in replacement
for the Pd-extended build system, which will be checked in soon.

I will try to create new binary distributions, usable with the
deken-plugin somewhere next week. These will contain the nettles. I try
to keep the current state of cyclone here:
http://puredata.info/downloads/cyclone/releases/0.1-alpha55 (never mind
the 55, it wouldn't go away).

Any object or abstraction that implements something present in Max(5)
could be part of cyclone.
>
> Cheers

Greetings,

Fred Jan
>
> 2015-06-07 9:41 GMT-03:00 Alexandre Torres Porres <porres@gmail.com
> <mailto:porres@gmail.com>>:
>
> yeah, I can't load these objects for some reason, I wonder why is
> that, I'm on mac os and extended 42, any idea?
>
> I didn't know they were in cyclone... But I remember we discussed
> about them, not all of them are part of zexy actually. Zexy's only
> got 3 out of these, whixh are: <~, >~ and ==~
>
> It doesn't have the remaining 9 objects: !-, !/, !-~, !/~, !=~,
> <=~, >=~, %~, +=~
>
> I think it's nice to have them, specially the [+=~] object which I
> didn't know about.
>
> So, the [maxmode] object loads these other objects, huh? I tried
> loading them with it and nothing happened.
>
> It seems weird to me that they have to depend on [maxmode], why
> can't you just get their code and make it available outside [maxmode]?
>
> cheers
>
>
> 2015-06-07 8:55 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan@xs4all.nl
> <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>>:

>
> Hi Alexandre,
>
> The nettles are the cyclone bin-ops objects we discussed before:
> !-, !/, ==~, !=~, <~, <=~, >~, >=~, !-~, !/~, %~, +=~
> They are part of the cyclone library object, which may or may not be
> part of your distribution. The source code is in
> externals/miXed/cyclone/shadow/nettles.c, hence the name.
>
> As it is a subset of what is in zexy, it is not very important
> to make
> them available again.
>
> Here a link to my copy of the original cyclone page:
> http://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/digaud/puredata/cyclone/cyclone_site/cyclone.html.
>
> Greetings,
>
> Fred Jan
>
> On 2015-06-06 01:06 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
> > So [maxmode] basically loads useless empty "dummy" objects for
> more
> > compability.
> >
> > Well, my two cents is that the idea of having a library with
> several
> > objects that exist in Max and not in Pd is great and awesome.
> It serves
> > well in making both worlds somewhat compatible. But regarding
> opening
> > the same files/patches, MAX and PD are just growing out to be very
> > incompatible projects, so it's rather healthy to forget about
> forcing
> > any compatibility of this type - it's just insane. It may have
> been
> > reasonable back in MAX 4.6, but nowadays, with MAX 7 and
> everything,
> > seems pointless.
> >
> > More than that, to answer your question, it's pretty obvious
> to me that
> > no human being is using this...
> >
> > Now, please tell about these /bin-ops //"nettles"/, what are
> these?
> >
> > cheers
> >
> > 2015-06-05 18:15 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan@xs4all.nl
> <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>

> > <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>>>:
> >
> > Hi Alexandre,
> >
> > >> No code will be removed, just the maxmode object and
> related
> > >> library objects will not be build anymore.
> > >
> > > So it'll remove many objects from the library, right?
> >
> > What will be removed is the actual maxmode object, the bin-ops
> > "nettles", ~150 dummy objects and the hammer and sickle
> libraries. The
> > hammer and sickle libraries contain the objects which are
> also available
> > as separate objects.
> > >
> > > I'm having a hard time understanding this [maxmode]
> thing/object, can
> > > you give us an example on how to use it?
> >
> > As I understand it, the purpose of the [maxmode] object is
> to make
> > importing and converting Max/MSP 4.6 patches more
> convenient. The dummy
> > objects do not do anything, but the patch will load
> without errors. The
> > idea is to replace the dummies with abstractions or other
> objects. The
> > dummies were the objects in Max/MSP4.6 but not in
> Pd-vanilla or cyclone.
> >
> > It might have made sense when Max/MSP 4.6 were common, but
> that is a
> > long time ago.
> >
> > The original cyclone page is gone from the site, but I
> made a copy just
> > in time:
> >
> http://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/digaud/puredata/cyclone/cyclone_site/cyclone.html.
> >
> > >
> > > cheers
> >
> > Greetings,
> >
> > Fred Jan
> > >
> > > 2015-05-01 17:48 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan
> <fjkraan@xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>
> <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>>
> > > <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>
> <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan@xs4all.nl>>>>:
> > >
> > > Hi All,
> > >
> > > Is anyone using the 'maxmode' object and
> functionality of the
> > > Cyclone library?
> > >
> > > The maxmode adds 162 dummy objects, which make
> importing of Max/MSP
> > > patches more convenient. Note these are Max/MSP 4.6
> patches, already
> > > supported in Pd-vanilla, not the more recent file
> formats. In
> > > addition several binop signal objects are loaded,
> the message and
> > > signal objects are loaded from library objects.
> Normal cyclone usage
> > > are individual objects.
> > >
> > > Because we are planning to switch to a new build
> system, usable for all
> > > Puredata external libraries, it would be an
> opportunity to simplify the
> > > building process and remove potential unused
> functionality.
> > >
> > > No code will be removed, just the maxmode object and
> related library
> > > objects will not be build anymore.
> > >
> > > Fred Jan
> > >
> > > P.S. The original cyclone page went off-line
> sometime this year, but
> > > here is a copy:
> > >
> http://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/digaud/puredata/cyclone/cyclone_site/cyclone.html
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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