dear list,

I spent some time with tkzinc using the python wrapper
and its pretty great...

see end of this page for a short demo of a zoomable interface (well the rest is all in french sorry)
http://vincentrioux.net/projets/arn/index.html

it's a bit of a pain to compile tkzinc on osx though (but it's feasible)

the developpers of Tkzinc say that they will release another version soon (which will drop bindings to X11 and will integrate better support of bitmaps and svg) - and it might be easier to port to osx but that is not their priority (apparently)

another possibility which i am investigating is using pyglet:
+ very close to opengl
+ it's pretty active
+ really cross-platform
- does not provide with all the geometrical transformations and gui power of tkzinc

best
vincent

Hans-Christoph Steiner a écrit : 
I think hacking tkzinc for Pd is still very much wide open.  I say go  
for it, try it out, and report any experience you might have.

.hc

On Jan 27, 2009, at 11:52 AM, harris_pilton@gmx.de wrote:

  
hi list,

is somebody still aware of this. i mean like having it on the agenda/
taking care of it. i'm sorry for not doing it. as i so far dont have
experience in programming it might wouldn't be a good idea to let me
do that ;) i wasnt even able to follow the whole discussion. but there
seemed everybody seemed to match there has to been something on that
field.
i just wondered if anybody is doing anything on this. (maybe 2 people
are doing same things on different channels - i dont hope thats the
case...).

thanks for not getting me wrong in advance.

regards


Am 22.01.2009 um 02:21 schrieb Hans-Christoph Steiner:

    
On Jan 19, 2009, at 6:23 PM, Luke Iannini wrote:

      
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner
<hans@eds.org> wrote:
        
On Jan 19, 2009, at 9:21 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:

          
Daniel Almeida wrote:
            
I dare say PD needs to ditch tcl/tk! SDL could be a good idea.

Daniel
              
yeah that's what i said about two years ago...

the problem is, at the moment tcl/tk is embedded quite deeply into
Pd
itself. this is a focus of the current pd-dev effort: trying to
clear this
up. tcl/tk in itself isn't _necessarily_ slow, it's just that the
way Pd is
using it is not at all optimised (for example, as Hans-Christoph
and i
discovered once, when you click-drag to move an element in a
graphical
table, not just the element you moved but _the entire table_ is
redrawn,
each time).

--
damian stewart | skype: damiansnz | damian@frey.co.nz
frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
            
It's slight worse, even.  The entire table is deleted and re- 
created
on each change, not even just redrawn.  That said, I am guessing
the C+
+ code on the GPU (Live) will always be quite a bit faster than  
Tcl/
Tk
on the CPU.  One of the ways that Live is able to make things fast
is
by ignoring the native widgets on each platform and coding their
own.
Tcl/Tk is the best GUI toolkit I've seen for making native-feeling
apps while writing cross-platform code.

If Live is really just blasting bitmaps to the screen, that is
something that Tcl/Tk can easily do.  But I am not sure that it
would
be the fastest way to implement GUI widgets.

If someone wants to help this situation, I think the best thing to
do
would be to create some GUI objects using TkZinc.  Then we'll have
Tcl/
Tk on the GPU and that should make things quite a bit faster.
          
Wow, hadn't heard of TkZinc.  That looks incredible.  Another cloud
for my Pd heaven : ).  As I've been writing, I'd really love to
create
GUIs entirely with Data Structures - I'm not sure how much of a
performance hit that causes but the opportunities for customization
are much richer when it's turtles all the way down (where turtles =
Pd).  Is TkZinc feasible for replacing the whole GUI?  It seems to
support all the platforms Pd does.
        
That is something to find out.  It sounds promising.  At least it
would be possible to write a TkZinc canvas which works like data
structures, but uses OpenGL.

.hc

      
Best
Luke

        
.hc


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