Pd-list December 2007

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129 participants
239 discussions

Is it possible to rotate particles?
by PSPunch 11 Dec '07

11 Dec '07

Hi all, Taking a break from audio processing for a while, I am lately appreciating playing around with GEM. I was wondering if there is an object that can add random rotation to each particle, or whither this was possible at all. I am imagining that the program internally contains the location and vector of each particle. If there is no array tracking the rotation (and maybe a rotation vector) of each particle, perhaps this is not possible easily. My initial goal is to render the particles as geos and have each rotate at different speeds. Any ideas appreciated. Thanks. -- David Shimamoto

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Fwd: [psql] object hand-holding
by Mike McGonagle 11 Dec '07

11 Dec '07

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Mike McGonagle <mjmogo(a)gmail.com> Date: Dec 10, 2007 1:07 PM Subject: Re: [PD] [psql] object hand-holding To: jamie(a)postlude.co.uk On 12/10/07, Jamie Bullock <jamie(a)postlude.co.uk> wrote: > > Good point! I think Hans' recent suggestion addresses the problem. It > also occurs to me that for Postgres at least, we have the PREPARE > statement, which addresses the optimisation and injection issues you > have raised. Technically [psql] already supports PREPARE except that > PREPARE uses the '$' character as its placeholder identifier, and '$1' > can't be passed around as a symbol in Pd. I think it might be > interesting to use the '?' notation currently under discussion as an > interface to PREPARE though. One of the things that I have been reading on this is that when you use these 'pre-complied' SQL statements, you need to 'bind' each of the variables with their types to a specific function. (Also, I kind of like the ':' syntax, as it puts a name to the data within the statement.) I also think that we would need to do something like [insert into table (id, name) values (:id, :name) ( <-- sent to the cold inlet [bind :id float( <-- sent to hold inlet [bind :name symbol( <-- sent to hold inlet [:id 1 ( <-- sent to hold inlet [:name john ( <-- sent to hold inlet [bang ( <-- sent to hold inlet and then we would be able to put all the data into the database with the expected types. At least SQLite and libdbi use these 'bind' functions to associate the expected datatype with the input data. Mike Jamie > > -- > www.postlude.co.uk > > > _______________________________________________ > PD-list(a)iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Peace may sound simple—one beautiful word— but it requires everything we have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. —Yehudi Menuhin (1916–1999), musician -- Peace may sound simple—one beautiful word— but it requires everything we have, every quality, every strength, every dream, every high ideal. —Yehudi Menuhin (1916–1999), musician

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SQL wrappers
by Hans-Christoph Steiner 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

I was just doing some research on SQL placeholders and I got an idea from this Python library for SQL: http://www.aminus.net/geniusql/wiki/SQLInjection Basically, if there are standard SQL interfaces to the various SQL database objects, then we can make some support objects that generate SQL queries from inlets. I can't really think of a way to make this very flexible off the top of my head, but I wanted to throw it out there. Then there could also be an object like Matju describes that you write the SQL in the object box as arguments, and it would automatically interpret the ? as placeholders and create inlets for them. The inlets would either have to be symbol inlets (numbers can be symbols but strings can be floats) or proxy inlets. [sql SELECT "ID" FROM "Animal" WHERE ("Animal"."Species" = 'Ape' or 1=1 or '')] This would have two outlets that are designed to plug right into the inlets that we have been describing. There could also be a [expr]- style SQL object. So I think the key thing is coming up with a core interface that makes it flexible and simple, and then it will be possible to make other wrapper interfaces. .hc ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---- Mistrust authority - promote decentralization. - the hacker ethic

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Re: [PD] [psql] object hand-holding (fwd)
by Mathieu Bouchard 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:52:25 -0500 (EST) From: Mathieu Bouchard <matju(a)artengine.ca> To: Mike McGonagle <mjmogo(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: [PD] [psql] object hand-holding On Mon, 10 Dec 2007, Mike McGonagle wrote: > While I think I understand what you are getting at, I think that is > something we should leave to version 2 of this. Basically, what I am > understanding is that you want to be able to "compile" an SQL statement, and > then insert new data by making another call that only sends the data. Is > that right? Yes. Imho that should be version 1. Else it reminds me of working in web programming and thinking up funny titles for items in the web app, such as: '; drop database web; select * from whatever where 'dummy'=' Which inserts nicely into pretty much any simple query statement of a dumb enough web app. do you want any pd patches to be dumb enough? _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada

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general questions on externals
by altern 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

hi The uni i am collaborating with has an engineer that did a image analisys tool on C couple of years ago. Now they want to port parts of it to PD creating an external. The engineer that does the job is checking the documentation about externals but he was getting some error. He doesnt have internet at home, doesnt like it. And does not use email much, on top of this he does not speak english ... :( so this might end up like japanese whispers ... As far as I understood he was trying to do a "hello world" example and was able to compile but the PD was not able to create the object despite of being placed into a folder within the PD path. He is using Visual Studio to compile. He was checking Flext as well. He was confused and he was asking which is the best way to go about creating externals under windows. I think he is using Visual Studio to compile. Sorry for such a stupid and basic question but I dont have a clue about externals so i cannot help him much directly. thanks for any tip! enrike

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xml-rpc client
by jim ruxton 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

Hi , does anyone know if there is an external available that works as an xml-rpc client? Thanks Jim

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Re: [PD] [psql] object hand-holding (fwd)
by Mathieu Bouchard 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2007 22:05:05 -0500 (EST) From: Mathieu Bouchard <matju(a)artengine.ca> To: Mike McGonagle <mjmogo(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: [PD] [psql] object hand-holding On Sun, 9 Dec 2007, Mike McGonagle wrote: > Actually, we do support placeholders in using a PD message. Basically, > anything that is a $1 will get replaced in the usual PD manner. It's not a real placeholder if it doesn't quote the content automatically, and it's also not a real placeholder if you don't provide the placeholder arguments separately from the statement: after all of the statement has been sent once, sending multiple lists of arguments should be invoking the same query (or queries), with different arguments. "In the usual PD manner" does not work. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada

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code and compilers
by Andrew Brouse 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

On Sat, 8 Dec 2007, pd-list-request(a)iem.at wrote: > On Fri, 7 Dec 2007, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> As for Pd vs. C, there was a time in the not-so-distant past where >> programmers thought that compilers were horribly inefficient, and that >> they were only really good for prototyping things. Then you'd code >> things for real in assembly. That lasted well into the 80's. > > It even lasted well into the 90's, but it depends for what. The 80's had > plenty ofy apps use a blend of asm and C-or-Pascal, while in the 90's > it became limited to really needy applications (games, demoscene, etc). > The amount of asm code still being written is shrinking but still somewhat > present. For example, devel_0_39 has asm code in it. I once wrote a final exam for a mandatory course in Assembly Language programming in the late 1990s where the most important question was to determine what a block of Motorola 68k assembly code was doing. People were just pulling their hair out! (mine never grew back!). It turned out the code was doing basically nothing. That was one of the best CS courses I ever took. An old-school hacker (poet turned progammer, classic!) once told me that he used to debug his programmes (on mainframes, with not even 1M of memory) by actually just watching a display of activity in all memory locations. After a while, he just subconsciously internalised what was going on and managed to debug the code. The questiion today might be whether auto-vectorising compilers are as good as hand-unrolled loops (I highly doubt it). The point is well-taken however: we should use high-level tools for the rapidity, expressivity and clarity they offer us in realising our particular ideas. It never hurts, nonetheless, to understand what that code is actually doing on the processor and in memory etc. On a fundamental level, any code we run is just changing patterns of electrons bouncing about on a wafer of impure silicon. Thus, when our high-level tools fail us or don't give the expected result, we sometimes have to dig down a little deeper. Maybe there is a chunk of code, like that block of 68k assembly, which is just churning electrons around, basicaly doing nothing. cheers, Andrew "[...] the introduction of the blackboard has had more impact on classroom education than any innovation in technology since, including the introduction of cheap paper or the introduction of the internet and personal computers" Bill Buxton

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Pd -extended 0.41 on debian : missing lib
by Olivier Heinry 10 Dec '07

10 Dec '07

Hi Hans, FYI there was a missing dependency while installing Pd-0.41.0-extended-20071209-debian-testing-i386.deb) under lenny : libgsl0 Plus I had to apt-get install tcl8.5 tk8.5 Hope this helps for fine-tuning ;-) I used to run the Geiger's 0.40-2 package before. Bye O. >

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pdpedia fr import running now
by Hans-Christoph Steiner 09 Dec '07

09 Dec '07

Bonjour, I got the final template from Jean-Noël and I am running it now. If there any existing pages, it won't delete them, instead it will just add a new revision, so you can get to the old pages thru the history. .hc ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---- I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - General Smedley Butler

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Pd-list December 2007