Hey all,
IOhannes started this discussion at PdCon, I think we should finish it. Since it is now quite easy to be added to the list of developers on the pure-data project, I think we should remove people if they are inactive for a long time (2 years). If they want to be active again, they can just post out to pd-dev like anyone else.
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
I believe IOhannes had the list with last commit dates (or some who never committed).
Lazy consensus time? :D
.hc
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¡El pueblo unido jamás será vencido!
i am not really a fan of removing people from a project, but maybe one could distinguish between 'active' and 'retired' developers ... retired developers should loose their cvs access, but still kept in the sourceforge developer lists ...
best, tim
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:42 -0400, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Hey all,
IOhannes started this discussion at PdCon, I think we should finish it. Since it is now quite easy to be added to the list of developers on the pure-data project, I think we should remove people if they are inactive for a long time (2 years). If they want to be active again, they can just post out to pd-dev like anyone else.
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
I believe IOhannes had the list with last commit dates (or some who never committed).
Lazy consensus time? :D
.hc
¡El pueblo unido jamás será vencido!
PD-dev mailing list PD-dev@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
-- tim@klingt.org ICQ: 96771783 http://tim.klingt.org
I must say I find television very educational. The minute somebody turns it on, I go to the library and read a good book. Groucho Marx
Can you explain why? It's really easy to get added again.
.hc
On Sep 10, 2007, at 5:49 PM, Tim Blechmann wrote:
i am not really a fan of removing people from a project, but maybe one could distinguish between 'active' and 'retired' developers ... retired developers should loose their cvs access, but still kept in the sourceforge developer lists ...
best, tim
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:42 -0400, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Hey all,
IOhannes started this discussion at PdCon, I think we should finish it. Since it is now quite easy to be added to the list of developers on the pure-data project, I think we should remove people if they are inactive for a long time (2 years). If they want to be active again, they can just post out to pd-dev like anyone else.
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
I believe IOhannes had the list with last commit dates (or some who never committed).
Lazy consensus time? :D
.hc
¡El pueblo unido jamás será vencido!
PD-dev mailing list PD-dev@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
-- tim@klingt.org ICQ: 96771783 http://tim.klingt.org
I must say I find television very educational. The minute somebody turns it on, I go to the library and read a good book. Groucho Marx
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kill your television
Tim Blechmann wrote:
i am not really a fan of removing people from a project, but maybe one could distinguish between 'active' and 'retired' developers ... retired developers should loose their cvs access, but still kept in the sourceforge developer lists ...
i agree with hans that i don't understand the reasoning behind this.
the list of project participants should not be mistaken as an "authors" list (there are lots of contributors of pd-core, external- and abstraction- code who have never enroled in the pd-cvs)
and deleting somebody from the list of project members is not an attempt to undo history. the repository logs will still hold the name of the original author.
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us. a usual clause for "vereins"-members (in morbid austria) is, that their membership ends with their death.
personally, i would not want to do the removal of jamie or gerard just because they are no longer with us. but i have little problem in having their sourceforge accounts be part of an automated process.
mfa.sdr IOhannes
Hallo, IOhannes m zmoelnig hat gesagt: // IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us. a usual clause for "vereins"-members (in morbid austria) is, that their membership ends with their death.
personally, i would not want to do the removal of jamie or gerard just because they are no longer with us. but i have little problem in having their sourceforge accounts be part of an automated process.
I agree with that. It's a delicate issue: James and Gerard will be with us in spirit. They belong to the project as long as the project exists.
But if we update the list and make it into a list of active developers - something which I would advocate - it would not be appropriate to keep their accounts in that list.
We should avoid to create the impression, that James' and Gerard's developer accounts are only listed because someone "forgot" to update the list.
Ciao
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo, IOhannes m zmoelnig hat gesagt: // IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us. a usual clause for "vereins"-members (in morbid austria) is, that their membership ends with their death.
personally, i would not want to do the removal of jamie or gerard just because they are no longer with us. but i have little problem in having their sourceforge accounts be part of an automated process.
I agree with that. It's a delicate issue: James and Gerard will be with us in spirit. They belong to the project as long as the project exists.
But if we update the list and make it into a list of active developers
- something which I would advocate - it would not be appropriate to keep
their accounts in that list.
We should avoid to create the impression, that James' and Gerard's developer accounts are only listed because someone "forgot" to update the list.
I guess that I am the only sentimental one here. I just thought it would be a nice gesture to leave them there.
On the technical side, I am opposed to making the removal of developers from the pure-data project an automatic or scripted thing. I think it should remain completely manual, and should be discussed everytime it happens. Developer access is a touchy subject and should be handled carefully, not automatically.
.hc
Ciao
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__
PD-dev mailing list PD-dev@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
zen \ \ \[D[D[D[D
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo, IOhannes m zmoelnig hat gesagt: // IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us. a usual clause for "vereins"-members (in morbid austria) is, that their membership ends with their death.
personally, i would not want to do the removal of jamie or gerard just because they are no longer with us. but i have little problem in having their sourceforge accounts be part of an automated process.
I agree with that. It's a delicate issue: James and Gerard will be with us in spirit. They belong to the project as long as the project exists.
But if we update the list and make it into a list of active developers
- something which I would advocate - it would not be appropriate to keep
their accounts in that list.
We should avoid to create the impression, that James' and Gerard's developer accounts are only listed because someone "forgot" to update the list.
I guess that I am the only sentimental one here. I just thought it would be a nice gesture to leave them there.
If you want them to be remembered, it may be better to name something after them. Not many people will be perusing the list of developers.
Martin
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, Martin Peach wrote:
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo, IOhannes m zmoelnig hat gesagt: // IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
I propose that we leave Gerard van Dongen and Jamie Tittle on the list since they are still with us in spirit.
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us. a usual clause for "vereins"-members (in morbid austria) is, that their membership ends with their death.
personally, i would not want to do the removal of jamie or gerard just because they are no longer with us. but i have little problem in having their sourceforge accounts be part of an automated process.
I agree with that. It's a delicate issue: James and Gerard will be with us in spirit. They belong to the project as long as the project exists.
But if we update the list and make it into a list of active developers
- something which I would advocate - it would not be appropriate to keep
their accounts in that list.
We should avoid to create the impression, that James' and Gerard's developer accounts are only listed because someone "forgot" to update the list.
I guess that I am the only sentimental one here. I just thought it would be a nice gesture to leave them there.
If you want them to be remembered, it may be better to name something after them. Not many people will be perusing the list of developers.
Martin
Yeah, I was planning on making this Pd-extended release in memory of Jamie. I was thinking of just putting that on the webpage, but I guess something better could be done.
.hc
zen \ \ \[D[D[D[D
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
Yeah, I was planning on making this Pd-extended release in memory of Jamie. I was thinking of just putting that on the webpage, but I guess something better could be done.
BTW, to make James remembered, a Pd-extended release is too short-lived. You should find something else, such as dedicating a new extern permanently, or naming a new extern with something related and particular to James. It's a lot more visible to people than an unused entry among many other unused entries in a list of people that few people ever look at and even then not so often.
Same for Gerard, of course...
Or perhaps someone wants to dedicate (permanently) an existing extern to either deceased person, preferably one that has some kind of "logical" link with what the person has contributed to the pd world.
_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada
Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
I guess that I am the only sentimental one here. I just thought it would be a nice gesture to leave them there.
Oh, I'm sentimental as well. I'm just not sure which gesture would be the right one to express this.
Ciao
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote:
i regret that i do not fully understand this request either. while both of them have contributed a lot and chances are high that they would be contributing if they were still with us, i do not see a point in treating them as if they were still among us.
A bodyless Spirit does not have internet access. If one of them ever wants to commit, he will possess someone who has commit access already, whoever that is.
_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801, Montréal QC Canada
sorry, but what's the problem with people just listening in??
while I haven't been doing much pd development since the gluiph days, I'm certainly interested in following its progress
Sukandar
On 9/10/07, Hans-Christoph Steiner hans@eds.org wrote:
Hey all,
IOhannes started this discussion at PdCon, I think we should finish it. Since it is now quite easy to be added to the list of developers on the pure-data project, I think we should remove people if they are inactive for a long time (2 years). If they want to be active again, they can just post out to pd-dev like anyone else.
Sukandar Kartadinata wrote:
sorry, but what's the problem with people just listening in??
i think this is a misunderstanding: we are not talking about the mailing list (pd-dev), but about the list of developers who have write access to the puredata repository at sourceforge (currently 63, 27 of which have not committed anything within the last 2 years; 13 have never committed anything in their life (the numbers are approximations as i am too lazy to look them up right now).
mfg.asdr IOhannes
-
Frank Barknecht -
Hans-Christoph Steiner -
IOhannes m zmoelnig -
Martin Peach -
Mathieu Bouchard -
Sukandar Kartadinata -
Tim Blechmann